10 questions on computer based audio

GREAT Read.

MANY Thanks

AN,
it interesting to see the different views..but some things remain common

1. USB Vs Firewire is all on the technical domain. in the end it is all about the design and Implementation
2. Jitter is the worst culprit and reducing it is the key
3. Jitter Can be removed
4. There is no doubting on the future of PC based audio
I really liked the responses by Steve Nugent, Gordon Rankin, and Charles hansen

BTW there is another on Cables.. http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue30/toc30.htm#interview

it is really funny as to how each person seems to have different eprspective here.

I will know in 2 weeks;

My Music Server is ready & so are my CD Players.

I will install every thing this week end.

Set up should be done over the next week.

Then, I shall do an 'a' against 'b' against 'c'

I will post.

All / Any forum member is welcome home - 2 weeks from now.
We can do a 'joint listening session' !!

Keep me in the loop.

bhagwan69 schrieb:

I will know in 2 weeks; My Music Server is ready & so are my CD Players. I will install every thing this week end. Set up should be done over the next week. Then, I shall do an 'a' against 'b' against 'c' I will post. All / Any forum member is welcome home - 2 weeks from now. We can do a 'joint listening session' !! Keep me in the loop. :.

This is when I wished I was in Bombay!!

bhagwan69 schrieb:

Then, I shall do an 'a' against 'b' against 'c' I will post. All / Any forum member is welcome home - 2 weeks from now. We can do a 'joint listening session' !! :.

Sir I am waiting with bated Breadth.
From what I could find out with my Trends UD10 (which obviusly is not t"there")..the sound is not good enough for serious listening.
but must say that what took me a couple of listening sessions to figure out Abhi_Pani figured out in the first 1 minute of listening

maybe my copper ears are turning to tin now..which can be a curse as well as a blessing depending on how you look at it


but if the $100 trends could do such a relatively great decent...am convinced of the potential of this medium.

Arj, As I have said before... ALL that you find sounding short in HDD playback compared to CD playback, using your DAC, is the fault of the UD-10. Its REALLY not a serious Hi Fi device... good for a second system of on the Work Table... even with the battery supply.

However USB DACs are emerging a plenty, and I am sure in a year we will have good playback at a decent price.

The Positive feedback opinions were an eye opener, and represent a range of thoughts - for the serious applicationh of mind to those that should not have come from anyone associated with serious Hi-Fi.

I am REALLY looking forward to listening to Bhagwan69's Music server. Sir - put me in line for a listen, I would like that VERY much

Bhagwan69 could you please post some more details of your music server? Personally I seem to have hit a roadblock with PCI internal cards and am looking to move away from that into an external USB or preferably Firewire device with a high quality dedicated external power unit.

About the UD10, have folks owning it tried the usb-audio.com driver instead of the default windows driver? Seems to bring in some benefits. However cheap Burr Brown PCM27xx devices will only do that much. You need something else to do better.

reignofchaos schrieb:

Bhagwan69 could you please post some more details of your music server? Personally I seem to have hit a roadblock with PCI internal cards and am looking to move away from that into an external USB or preferably Firewire device with a high quality dedicated external power unit. About the UD10, have folks owning it tried the usb-audio.com driver instead of the default windows driver? Seems to bring in some benefits. However cheap Burr Brown PCM27xx devices will only do that much. You need something else to do better.

i use the ASIO driver to Bypass the Kmixer and also use it only for USB to SPDIF..feeing into my Dac.

I use the SPDIF out from my M Audio Audiophile 192 PCI Sound Card with ASIO drivers to feed into my DAC. I don't have an external USB sound card to do an A to B comparison. But, I am curious to know if going with an external sound card will make a difference.

Arj schrieb:

i use the ASIO driver to Bypass the Kmixer and also use it only for USB to SPDIF..feeing into my Dac.

Do you use ASIO4ALL or the usb-audio.com ASIO driver? ASIO4ALL is okay but not as good as a real ASIO driver. If you use foobar and vista, you could try the WASAPI output too. Seemingly the performance of that is better than ASIO. My music rig is too slow to run vista because I've underclocked it.

@Surreallistix:

It might make a difference only if the SPDIF of the external device is well implemented - for example the empirical audio off ramp devices. My current internal EMU 1212M is a whole lot better than the external M-Audio Audiophile I had earlier. So if people blindly advocate USB/Firewire solutions, take their opinions with a pinch of salt :).

An excellent option if someone knows modding is to feed I2S straight from the controller chip of the soundcard to the DAC. Not that easy, but potentially the best solution.

bombaywalla schrieb:

bhagwan69 schrieb: :. This is when I wished I was in Bombay!! :cut

Sir,

My doors are wide open for you.
You are most welcome - without a phone call too;;;

In any case, when evr you come - all 3 should be there, unless any 1 [or 2] gets 'badly' beaten & I am forced to sell it.

You can come & we will listen to your CD on a CD Player & EAC it on a HDD & play it off the Weiss !!

Amp_Nut schrieb:

I am REALLY looking forward to listening to Bhagwan69's Music server. Sir - put me in line for a listen, I would like that VERY much :)

Hello AN !

My house just finished this evening.
I am get all the goods moved in from the warehouse on Saturday.
I shall get the system started by mid next week - hopefully.

I am going to play the Penaudio to start with;
I shall request you to come home some time towards the end of next week.
I too shall need 'help' to decide on what is going on.

In my case there is no USB - there is Firewire - 6 pin.

reignofchaos schrieb:

Bhagwan69 could you please post some more details of your music server? However cheap Burr Brown PCM27xx devices will only do that much. You need something else to do better.

Hello Sir !

My knowledge on computers is redamentary.
I just did what a fellow forum member helped me with - sbfx -

I have used an ANTEC HTPC Case + Asus MB + Firewire [6 pin] put to a Weiss DAC @ 24/192.

I will use foobar.

Shall let you know how it goes.

surrealistix schrieb:

I use the SPDIF out from my M Audio Audiophile 192 PCI Sound Card with ASIO drivers to feed into my DAC. But, I am curious to know if going with an external sound card will make a difference.

Why go to a card ?

Motherboard out to DAC - straight - that too on 24/192 & you DAC will lock @ 192.

USB can do 24/96 - not more.
Dual SPDIF or Dual AES/EBU too will do 24/192, but no sound card will support 2 digital outs [not to my knowledge] !!
This is what Chord / Teac Esoteric use between transport & DAC.

Bhagwan,

you should really try to get a Scott Nixon USB DAC to compare along side too. The difference that a NOS DAC makes is going to be huge and apparent against all the other oversampling DACs. I personally feel that the Scott Nixon is a lot more enjoyable than the Bel Canto DAC2 and this is at a third of the price.

Also, I now that there is an Indian with a Twisted Pear Audio Buffalo DAC in Mumbai...perhaps you might be tempted to rope him in andcheck out the ESS chip based DAC.

Thanks;
I am open to trying things out.
I have my Music Server.
We can take a Firewire or USB out from it to any DAC & play it through the rest of the chain.
Who has that DAC ?
Let me know so I could PM & request a visit home with it.
Appreciate it.

Savyasaachi said:

Also, I now that there is an Indian with a Twisted Pear Audio Buffalo DAC in Mumbai...perhaps you might be tempted to rope him in andcheck out the ESS chip based DAC.

Please post / PM his contact details. i would LOVE to contact him.

Thanks

I have sent a PM to him to see if he is interested. I will post/PM when he replies.

I use the ASIO drivers from M Audio rather than ASIO4ALL.

I have recently upgraded from my Odeon Lite Dac to Scott Nixon NOS Dac - and it's a day and night difference.

surrealistix schrieb:

I use the ASIO drivers from M Audio rather than ASIO4ALL. I have recently upgraded from my Odeon Lite Dac to Scott Nixon NOS Dac - and it's a day and night difference.

Cheers to that buddy...such a good DAC isn't it the Scott Nixon?

True giant killer i tell you.

Browsing through this post I thought I would let you know what PC I will aim for soon:
http://www.endpcnois...nless_mcubed_pc.html

What's really important to me is, that there are no fans. I am intending to use this machine in the living room, install a very basic Linux on it, and run XBMC on it (amazing free and open-source media center software). Especially when watching movies, I want the machine to be absolutely quiet. I will only play music and videos that are hosted on another Linux file server in another room of my house.

Any comments are appreciated

Ran into another USB to SPDIF converter by Lindemann.

http://www.aaudioimports.com/ShowProduct.asp?hProduct=125

has anyone come across this ?

Bhagwan how was your experience with the media center ? eagerly awaiting information !

Arj schrieb:

Bhagwan how was your experience with the media center ? eagerly awaiting information !

Superb !

I really like it.

Amp Nut has heard it, maybe he could comment on it;

Gear is all still Brand New - need some time to burn in & will compare after 1 month & will write a full report then.....

reignofchaos schrieb:

[Do you use ASIO4ALL or the usb-audio.com ASIO driver? ASIO4ALL is okay but not as good as a real ASIO driver. If you use foobar and vista, you could try the WASAPI output too. Seemingly the performance of that is better than ASIO. My music rig is too slow to run vista because I've underclocked it.

Apologies, i saw this only now.
I do use the Asio4All as am still on XP(older Processer ) is there a version fo XP ? if so i will try out the other one once i get my digital cable back..it is with someone who is trying it out. BTW I use a Monarchy reclocker with the trends SPDIF out as it makes the sound smoother.

bhagwan69 schrieb:

Superb ! I really like it.

Great to hear that.
AN sir ..your impressions please.

aparently the products have an option of USB-SPDIF conversion as well.
http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?icomp&1238247027
as per Steve Nugent

in fact in the empirical audio website he recommends it with his DAC/Jitter reducer.