What’s up with these digital amp makers ? Absolute sound editor’s choice award…

How's Flying Mole D-amp? That's much cheaper than CIAudio and it's available in Delhi with the Sound of Music for Rs. 27 K and on the Flying Mole website for about 18 K - www.flyingmole.co.jp

When I hear them at the Delhi AV Show they sounded pretty nice but then the whole grid consisted of very good quality components.


BTW CIA website is www.ciaudio.com

Any inputs?

Regards

Sanjay

Yup,

I heard the Flying Mole Mono Blocks at my place, on my set-up, replacing my Prima Luna Prologue-2.

My thoughts.....

These are Digital Power amps, and are INCREDIBLY light... about 1 Kg each... putting out 100Watts into 8 ohms or 160 Watts into 4 Ohms . My Sonus fabor Extremas are 4 Ohms.

Being power amps, and the fact that they were being dropped in place of my PL-2 Valve ( 40 Valve Watts ) integrated, meant that I woould need a Pre amp to vary the Volume... between my CD Player and the FMs.

I did not have a Pre Amp on hand.

Lucikily for me, the FMs have an input attenuator on the Front Panel of each monoblock. This is provided actually to trim output levels in a HT system, feeding different speakers or for an odd speaker placement. The input trimmers are to be used typically at also 'Full Volume' so that the trimmers degrade the sound the least, and are practically out of circuit.

No Pre amp, so I exploited the trimmers as my Volume control... worked DANDY... with probably a small / tiny hit on the sound quality.

THE SOUND:
The FMs had power... Not the Krell kind that says to the speakers ' I have got you by the short & curlys' but good and ample power. Though I must say that my speakers managed to soak almost all that the FMs could offer.

The extra power and the solid state drive gave good bass, and more than control, I heasrd bass that the PL Valve amp just could not deliver in therms of shere power.

The sound was smooth, though not overly so. The treble was good, though clearly not in the Ultra Fi league, which my PL aspires to ( but does not quite get there ).

The treble was clean and neat, though it missed the Electrostat or Ribbon delicacy that I crave for.

The mid ramge was Very nice, and the low level resolution was good, but not exceptional... I suspect partly due to the High Freq Air that was missing.

Soundstage was Good, almost Very good. Instruments had fairly precise locations, though the image was a little conscricted. Te sound stage improved at higher volume... infact the overall sound was better when the FMs were driven hard.


My main B against the FM was ( Unfairly) the lack of that Ultimate touch of Air & delicacy.

Tempted, I bi-amped my Speakers... the FMs feeding the power hungry LF and the Valves the Tweeters.

I was hoping for the Ultimate fusion of Valves and SS, providing me Nirvana, but it just did not sing... The sound was lumpy... instead of the best of both worlds, I got the WORST of both worlds.... Tough luck for me otherwise this would be 1 cheap nirvana !

To summarise... the FMs at Rs 27 K ( the price Doc states ) are as WINNER. Will trounce a NAD anywhere close to that price, or even at double that price.

If I did not have my Valve PL ( almost 3 times that price ) I would have Bought the Flying Moles. They are GOOD... almost GREAT, but at that price, dont kid yourself that they provide statement amplification.

After listning to them, I both, Liked and respected the Flying Moles. ... GREAT Value.

Dear Amp_Nut !

Thanks for a comprehensive & crisp review !

BTW why did you not use pre-out from PL (I don't know if it has one)?

Regards

Sanjay

Amp_Nut schrieb:

Yup, The extra power and the solid state drive gave good bass, and more than control, I heasrd bass that the PL Valve amp just could not deliver in therms of shere power.

the s.s. amps, as you well know, have lower output impedance (there must/could be negative feedback) hence the damping factor must be higher yielding better bass control.
Seems like you got better bass punch?
What was the bass quality like? one-note bass? or, did the bass have distinct notes?

Amp_Nut schrieb:

The mid ramge was Very nice, and the low level resolution was good, but not exceptional... I suspect partly due to the High Freq Air that was missing.

I wonder why the low level resolution wasn't as good as you expected? Amp too noisy? Too much noise in your system? something else?

Amp_Nut schrieb:

Soundstage was Good, almost Very good. Instruments had fairly precise locations, though the image was a little conscricted.

could this be an artifact of the power supply? making power supply mods on the rectifier & ripple caps might open up the sound. In DACs, replacing in-circuit electrolytics by better quality 'lytics or polypropylene caps opens up the soundstage. Wonder if these FM amps will also benefit from such a mod?

Amp_Nut schrieb:

My main B against the FM was ( Unfairly) the lack of that Ultimate touch of Air & delicacy.

this is what I hear all the time re. these digital amps!!

Amp_Nut schrieb:

Tempted, I bi-amped my Speakers... the FMs feeding the power hungry LF and the Valves the Tweeters. I was hoping for the Ultimate fusion of Valves and SS, providing me Nirvana, but it just did not sing... The sound was lumpy... instead of the best of both worlds, I got the WORST of both worlds.... Tough luck for me otherwise this would be 1 cheap nirvana !

yes, it seems that the sound from the 2 amps were vastly different & they did not cross-over seemlessly. I think that you could find a s.s. amp for your bass drivers but it'll take some trial & error.

Amp_Nut schrieb:

After listning to them, I both, Liked and respected the Flying Moles. ... GREAT Value.

i think that this says it all (according to me!).

Doc Said

BTW why did you not use pre-out from PL (I don't know if it has one)?

U R correct... the PL does not have a Pre oout.... in fact not even a Tape out..

All this is due to the fact that the PL infact has only a passiove Pre. Input from the CD player goes to a High impedance Volume pot.

hence the damping factor must be higher yielding better bass control. Seems like you got better bass punch? What was the bass quality like? one-note bass? or, did the bass have distinct notes?

Actually, the point I was trying to make was quite the opposite .

The FM bass was NOT the type that could start & stop instantanously . Neither was it Particularly rhythmic. I just felt that it resolved more bass info than my valve amp, because it had the Power ( NOT control) to deliver in the bass... like when rapid bass notes are played. Turn the volume up on a low powered amp, and the bass notes muddle up.

No I am Not referring to flabby bass... just Under-powered bass.

I wonder why the low level resolution wasn't as good as you expected? Amp too noisy? Too much noise in your system? something else?

Yes, could be HF noise on the FMs... cant really tell, because Ultrasonic noise manifests itself in weird ways sometimes... even adds depth in some cases !

In this particular audition, I was listning to the Brush being rubed on the drum skin... in the background, in Janis Ian and Jack Johnson CDs.

It sounded better when the PL came back into the system. Hence I doubt it was the 'system' just the FM amps.

Incidentally, the BEST I have heard this ( Brush on Drum skin was on the system at an audiophile's place, using a Hoveland Amp, Cadence 845 valve based 200 Watt power amp and Cadence Electrostat speakers ( which he has since changed )... oooooooooh !

My main B against the FM was ( Unfairly) the lack of that Ultimate touch of Air & delicacy. this is what I hear all the time re. these digital amps!!

Digital amps Necessarily roll off Ultrasonic HF, ( and I suspect even more so at 4 ohm loads than 8 ohm loads ) and I suspect this is what creates 'air and delicacy' or the lack of it.

To sum up once again.... The Flying Moles do Every thing well. They dont fail at ANYTHING, but then they are Not Exceptional at anything either... except Value For Money.

Hey guys, as someone pointed out to me.... the FMs are available in a 12 V DC operation option also !

Will make absolutely KILLER Car audio amps...

Incidentally, the Specific Flying Mole amps I heard were The Flying Mole DAD-M100pro HT Type. See at :

http://www.flyingmoleelectronics.com/products/m100proseries.html

Note that the Flying Mole amps use a Switched Mode power supply, while the CIAudio uses a Torroid Transformer based power supply.

I think the CIAudio also uses the Ultra Class D ( UCD ) technology.... different from the FMs.

UCD was devised particularly to ensure the Class D amp's performance is independent of the speaker load.