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Experience with a self-acclaimed audio God

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Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#1 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 11:28
Hi Folks,

I am going to share my experience with a guy who sells hi-fi audio equipments in Bangalore. I am not sure how many of you have had similar experiences with this guy, but I did find him quite a distasteful character. The purpose of this message is two-fold; a) to discuss in open the (mis)dealings of this guy, b) make other members aware of what's in store if they are yet to experience the idiosyncrasies of this guy.

Let me term this guy as 'P' to give a name during the discussion. P stays near Cubbon road in Bangalore. The very first look of P will give you a glimpse of something never seen before; a man landing straight from the red planet Mars. After your formal introduction with P, he will be quick to remind you of how busy his schedule is and that he couldn't have met you without an appointment. I wonder how many personal secretaries manage the calendar of the self-proclaimed audio genius. The president of a country may have a leaner schedule than P.

Next, you will be accompanied into his audition room where you will indeed find some good hi-fi equipment. Don't you dare to ask the price of any equipment. Should you dare so, reduce the price by 50% mentally to know the actual retail price of the equipment. Another important point to note, the price of the same equipment progressively increases with your number of subsequent visits. I am sure the price includes the shipping and handling charges of getting the equipments from the red planet.

During the discussion you will be reminded numerous times that you should trust your ears and nothing else before buying an equipment. Then P will be quick to point out that the equipments he has currently are the best in the world and you should buy those. Upon asking for comparison with another set of equipments not available with P, he will be more than glad to reveal his number of years of experience in hi-fi audio industry and that you should go with his advice to buy the equipments he has without bothering about other contemporary products not available with him and more importantly, without bothering to trust your ears.
On the contrary, during your subsequent visits, if you find another set of equipments not seen before, don't be surprised if God P advices you to buy those as those would be the best in the world as God says so and possesses them. In a nutshell, if you don't heed God's advice, you are cursed and doomed.

You will finally find mention of some of P's customers who have spent numerous lakhs setting up their systems. This will really make you wonder if P read out some bed time Arabian Nights stories to his daughter the previous night and assumed himself of a royal (king/prince) character who makes his wishes come true with a drop of an eyelid!!

Wish you all the very best if you happen to run into this repulsive character. But I do sincerely hope my experience helps you in the hour or two of distress you spend with him.

I am waiting for the day when competition will kill the whims and fancies of P and I don't see the day too far.
deaf
Stammgast
#2 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 13:00

Dare_Devil schrieb:
Hi Folks,

I am going to share my experience with a guy who sells hi-fi audio equipments in Bangalore. I am not sure how many of you have had similar experiences with this guy, but I did find him quite a distasteful character. The purpose of this message is two-fold; a) to discuss in open the (mis)dealings of this guy, b) make other members aware of what's in store if they are yet to experience the idiosyncrasies of this guy.

Let me term this guy as 'P' to give a name during the discussion. P stays near Cubbon road in Bangalore. The very first look of P will give you a glimpse of something never seen before; a man landing straight from the red planet Mars. After your formal introduction with P, he will be quick to remind you of how busy his schedule is and that he couldn't have met you without an appointment. I wonder how many personal secretaries manage the calendar of the self-proclaimed audio genius. The president of a country may have a leaner schedule than P.

Next, you will be accompanied into his audition room where you will indeed find some good hi-fi equipment. Don't you dare to ask the price of any equipment. Should you dare so, reduce the price by 50% mentally to know the actual retail price of the equipment. Another important point to note, the price of the same equipment progressively increases with your number of subsequent visits. I am sure the price includes the shipping and handling charges of getting the equipments from the red planet.

During the discussion you will be reminded numerous times that you should trust your ears and nothing else before buying an equipment. Then P will be quick to point out that the equipments he has currently are the best in the world and you should buy those. Upon asking for comparison with another set of equipments not available with P, he will be more than glad to reveal his number of years of experience in hi-fi audio industry and that you should go with his advice to buy the equipments he has without bothering about other contemporary products not available with him and more importantly, without bothering to trust your ears.
On the contrary, during your subsequent visits, if you find another set of equipments not seen before, don't be surprised if God P advices you to buy those as those would be the best in the world as God says so and possesses them. In a nutshell, if you don't heed God's advice, you are cursed and doomed.

You will finally find mention of some of P's customers who have spent numerous lakhs setting up their systems. This will really make you wonder if P read out some bed time Arabian Nights stories to his daughter the previous night and assumed himself of a royal (king/prince) character who makes his wishes come true with a drop of an eyelid!!

Wish you all the very best if you happen to run into this repulsive character. But I do sincerely hope my experience helps you in the hour or two of distress you spend with him.

I am waiting for the day when competition will kill the whims and fancies of P and I don't see the day too far.


Dear DD
This character P really seems to be something else,do tell us some more.
Regards.
SNV
Stammgast
#3 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 14:00
ah, what the hell, even i wanna know more about this self acclaimed god.
Pls shed some more light dd.

regards
Jeeves
Stammgast
#4 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 14:24
Dear DD
Is it Prithvi you are talking about? He stays near Cubbon Road in Bangalore.
Well if it is him you are refering to, I like Prithvi and I have a great time with him. His advice to me is invaluable and I respect his knowledge. I would find it difficult to deal with another dealer, especially one who does not know his stuff.
Regards
square_wave
Inventar
#5 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 15:58
Dear DD,
Are you referring to Prithvi ? As Jeeves mentioned, he is the most useful and knowledgeable audio-dealer/consultant I have met in Bangalore. He is respected well among most seasoned audiophiles in Bangalore. Maybe he is busy…maybe he has got rich clients (who else can buy expensive audio-stuff ?)…..so ? If you go to modern world in brigades, will he recommend videocon TV to you from the neighboring store? He will recommend Sony or whatever he stocks, right ? Why should an audio dealer be any different? As far as I know, Prithvi stocks stuff which he believes in and he will definitely recommend it. But I have never heard him say something he stocks is the best in the world and I know him for more than 4 years now. It is the duty of the customer to educate himself on what he wants. This is true with any product like cars, jeans or whatever. Know what you want and buy it…….end of the story right ?? How do you know the prices can’t be bargained if you really interested in buying a product ?
Could you please identify yourself ? Quite a few of us are from Bangalore only. When did you meet Prithvi ? Could you give us a date please ?
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#6 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 16:14

deaf schrieb:

Dear DD
This character P really seems to be something else,do tell us some more.
Regards.



Need I say anymore? Aren't the details enough and implicit enough?
deaf
Stammgast
#7 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 16:14

square_wave schrieb:
Dear DD,
Are you referring to Prithvi ? As Jeeves mentioned, he is the most useful and knowledgeable audio-dealer/consultant I have met in Bangalore. He is respected well among most seasoned audiophiles in Bangalore. Maybe he is busy…maybe he has got rich clients (who else can buy expensive audio-stuff ?)…..so ? If you go to modern world in brigades, will he recommend videocon TV to you from the neighboring store? He will recommend Sony or whatever he stocks, right ? Why should an audio dealer be any different? As far as I know, Prithvi stocks stuff which he believes in and he will definitely recommend it. But I have never heard him say something he stocks is the best in the world and I know him for more than 4 years now. It is the duty of the customer to educate himself on what he wants. This is true with any product like cars, jeans or whatever. Know what you want and buy it…….end of the story right ?? How do you know the prices can’t be bargained if you really interested in buying a product ?
Could you please identify yourself ? Quite a few of us are from Bangalore only. When did you meet Prithvi ? Could you give us a date please ?


Yeah DD, true, square has a point,and the fact two guys can stand up for this chap P in a matter of a hour or so, it is recommendable.Just my thoughts,besides who knows if your chap P and this chap Prithvi are one and the same.
Regards
Arj
Inventar
#8 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 16:16
Prithvi is a dealer and it is his job to sell. it is the consumers job to make an informed decision..especially when you have the entire internet to find out prices before you buy..Trust your ears is hence very apt

In my experience with him he set up a time with me even when he knew i had no interntion to buy. we spent at least 1- 2 hours in his demo room listening and swapping various music on his systems and even allowed me to demo my amp with them. in fact he opened up my amp and did a "Free cleanup" of the contacts inside. BTW Also met up with young Ben there

To me that has been perhaps one of the better experiences with a dealer.(And I have seen my share of rude and bad ones)

It would be interesting to hear Prithvis side of the story, if he does respond to this as to what his thought of Dare_Devils behavious has been.. ; very often even customers may not be angels

Making remarks like these could hurt someones business (As I too was very nicely reminded of by another gentleman in this forum whom I am thankful to )and hence please be more careful and request more substantial details in case you indeed have been wronged.
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#9 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 16:16

SNV schrieb:
ah, what the hell, even i wanna know more about this self acclaimed god.
Pls shed some more light dd.

regards


I think the details provided are self-explanatory. Are you interested in anything specific?
deepug
Ist häufiger hier
#10 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 16:22
I also have met Prithvi more than twice . The last time we met he was even aware of the fact that I had picked up a set of speakers from some where else. Still he spend quite a good amount of time with me

Best regards
Deepu
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#11 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 16:32

Jeeves schrieb:
Dear DD
Is it Prithvi you are talking about? He stays near Cubbon Road in Bangalore.
Well if it is him you are refering to, I like Prithvi and I have a great time with him. His advice to me is invaluable and I respect his knowledge. I would find it difficult to deal with another dealer, especially one who does not know his stuff.
Regards


Please do not put words in my mouth. I have not named anyone here. However, I cannot restrain people from drawing their conclusions. Knowledge to me is very relative. If I am a novice, which I am, I might consider a person a step ahead of me as an expert. I am fine with the person claiming to be more knowledgeable than me. But I will be disappointed if the person boasts to be best and misguiding a genuine customer seeking guidance and direction. I have come across much better audiophiles than P who have extended genuine help and guidance even if that meant my losing interest in the products they were stacking. I am sharing my experience relative to my many dealings. I respect your opinion and value your experiences. At the same time, I am entitled to my views and opinions and am free to express the same like any other member in the forum.
Arj
Inventar
#12 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 16:35
yes you are and so is everyone else in the forum

thats what makes forums interesting...everyone is entitled an opinion and each opinion is equally valid.
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#13 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 16:40

Arj schrieb:
Prithvi is a dealer and it is his job to sell. it is the consumers job to make an informed decision..especially when you have the entire internet to find out prices before you buy..Trust your ears is hence very apt

In my experience with him he set up a time with me even when he knew i had no interntion to buy. we spent at least 1- 2 hours in his demo room listening and swapping various music on his systems and even allowed me to demo my amp with them. in fact he opened up my amp and did a "Free cleanup" of the contacts inside. BTW Also met up with young Ben there

To me that has been perhaps one of the better experiences with a dealer.(And I have seen my share of rude and bad ones)

It would be interesting to hear Prithvis side of the story, if he does respond to this as to what his thought of Dare_Devils behavious has been.. ; very often even customers may not be angels

Making remarks like these could hurt someones business (As I too was very nicely reminded of by another gentleman in this forum whom I am thankful to )and hence please be more careful and request more substantial details in case you indeed have been wronged.


Please refer to my response to Jeeves for the commonalities. Some specifics concerning your response.

Informed decision is possible only when you get the right information and direction. Misguiding and misleading newcomers isn't very ethical from my perspective even if you are a businessman. I don't have any problems with the statement 'Trust your ears'; however it does not speak highly of a person demonstrating an opposite behaviour than what he preaches. That's the concern I have raised with my experience.
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#14 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 16:56

square_wave schrieb:
Dear DD,
Are you referring to Prithvi ? As Jeeves mentioned, he is the most useful and knowledgeable audio-dealer/consultant I have met in Bangalore. He is respected well among most seasoned audiophiles in Bangalore. Maybe he is busy…maybe he has got rich clients (who else can buy expensive audio-stuff ?)…..so ? If you go to modern world in brigades, will he recommend videocon TV to you from the neighboring store? He will recommend Sony or whatever he stocks, right ? Why should an audio dealer be any different? As far as I know, Prithvi stocks stuff which he believes in and he will definitely recommend it. But I have never heard him say something he stocks is the best in the world and I know him for more than 4 years now. It is the duty of the customer to educate himself on what he wants. This is true with any product like cars, jeans or whatever. Know what you want and buy it…….end of the story right ?? How do you know the prices can’t be bargained if you really interested in buying a product ?
Could you please identify yourself ? Quite a few of us are from Bangalore only. When did you meet Prithvi ? Could you give us a date please ?


Please refer to my response to Jeeves for commonalities. Regarding the TV example; I think the dealer has the right to promote the products he has. How about this as an example. Dealer stacks products of brand A and brand B. If you visit the dealer and he has stock of A and not B, he recommends A as the best product and better than B and recommends buying. At another time if you visit the dealer and you find B and not A, you are suggested to buy B as that now has become best and better than A. You are also given the rationale of the experience of the dealer to make good suggestions. This to me is purely unethical. It is certainly the duty of the customers to be informed. On the contrary, I don't think it is the duty of a dealer to mislead, financial status of the customer (rich/poor) notwithstanding. How would anyone feel once trusting a dealer in buying a product and later finding out cheated on information, price, etc? I am not making these comments because I am uninformed. I am making these comments after careful analysis and reasoning of the information I recieved from P and knowing the reality which was quite different from the information I recieved. Had I trusted in the initial information I recieved, I probably would have worshipped P, till I found the reality.
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#15 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 16:58

Arj schrieb:
yes you are and so is everyone else in the forum

thats what makes forums interesting...everyone is entitled an opinion and each opinion is equally valid.


Agreed.
sivat
Stammgast
#16 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 17:12
I've known prithvi for quite a few years....but i still take appointment to meet him. I fail to understand why it wrong for someone to say he has a busy schedule....and requests an prior appointment ??

Since people generally spend 1-3 hours, there can hardly be demo for 2-3 people a day. So it is actually better for the customer to request a prior appointment. Imagine the Chaos if multiple people land up for a demo at the same time.

Cheers
Siva.


[Beitrag von sivat am 28. Sep 2005, 17:20 bearbeitet]
jsa_ind
Stammgast
#17 erstellt: 28. Sep 2005, 22:04
Dear Dare Devil,

While you are obviously disappointed with your experience, please don't give up ! There is no point in getting upset ! Doing so, is only allowing the circumstance to control you rather then you controlling the circumstance !

There are still dealers who are willing to co-operate & are helpful. It is all about searching till you find the right one.

Like you rightly said it is a matter of time before the concept of selling audio would change...it is coming so hang on till then !!

Regards,

Junia.
SNV
Stammgast
#18 erstellt: 29. Sep 2005, 07:55
Dear DD,

tell you what, i havent met Prithvi personally but
i have heard about him. I too am a commercial dealer.
Believe me, we work purely on appointments. And let me
clarify why we do this.
An appointment is infact necessary and beneficial
to the customer. You get personalised attention.
As much time as you want is dedicated to you and
you only. We get to know what your requirement is and
then accordingly we recommend whats ideal. We need info
on things like your room size, budget, music tastes, etc.

Most of the hifi dealers stock brands they believe in,
so obviously they would promote those labels only.
The golden rule still remains : trust your ears.
One needs to visit few dealers and audition a couple
of brands and then decide what sounds the best to him.
But most definitely the dealer will recommend only the
brands he stocks or can make available.

I would like to state you an example as well:
You go to an electronic showroom looking for a tv.
You shortlist on sony and philips. Now both the tvs
are good, but the dealer tells you that the philips is
better than the sony only because he has a higher margin
on the philips.
Believe me when i say this, every outlet does this.
If you were find this out, you would think you were
misleaded, whereas the dealer still thinks he did
recommend a good tv and he made some money.

Welcome to the real world.

Maybe you did have bad experience, i dont think anybody
is denying that. Not every client is comfortable with
every dealer. Everyone has their favourites and not so
favourites.

Anyways as Junia quoted, dont get disappointed.
There are a lot of other dealers who would be glad to
help you decide a configuration.

Regards
Jay
square_wave
Inventar
#19 erstellt: 29. Sep 2005, 10:01

SNV schrieb:
Dear DD,

tell you what, i havent met Prithvi personally but
i have heard about him. I too am a commercial dealer.
Believe me, we work purely on appointments. And let me
clarify why we do this.
An appointment is infact necessary and beneficial
to the customer. You get personalised attention.
As much time as you want is dedicated to you and
you only. We get to know what your requirement is and
then accordingly we recommend whats ideal. We need info
on things like your room size, budget, music tastes, etc.

Most of the hifi dealers stock brands they believe in,
so obviously they would promote those labels only.
The golden rule still remains : trust your ears.
One needs to visit few dealers and audition a couple
of brands and then decide what sounds the best to him.
But most definitely the dealer will recommend only the
brands he stocks or can make available.

I would like to state you an example as well:
You go to an electronic showroom looking for a tv.
You shortlist on sony and philips. Now both the tvs
are good, but the dealer tells you that the philips is
better than the sony only because he has a higher margin
on the philips.
Believe me when i say this, every outlet does this.
If you were find this out, you would think you were
misleaded, whereas the dealer still thinks he did
recommend a good tv and he made some money.

Welcome to the real world.

Maybe you did have bad experience, i dont think anybody
is denying that. Not every client is comfortable with
every dealer. Everyone has their favourites and not so
favourites.

Anyways as Junia quoted, dont get disappointed.
There are a lot of other dealers who would be glad to
help you decide a configuration.

Regards
Jay


Same thoughts here !
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#20 erstellt: 29. Sep 2005, 12:01

deaf schrieb:

Yeah DD, true, square has a point,and the fact two guys can stand up for this chap P in a matter of a hour or so, it is recommendable.Just my thoughts,besides who knows if your chap P and this chap Prithvi are one and the same.
Regards


By the way deaf, you neither know me, nor do you know P. Neither do you possibly know the two guys you are talking about. What makes you support the 2 guys who have shared their personal experiences with a guy Prithvi and not trust my experience? This gives me an inkling that you are possibly either P or Prithvi. What do you think?
sbfx
Stammgast
#21 erstellt: 29. Sep 2005, 12:35
I'll vouch for deaf that he's not P(Prithvi) also I have brought some stuff from Prithvi in the past but never met him I will surely rec him easy to deal with.


Regards,

Satyam.
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#22 erstellt: 29. Sep 2005, 16:42

SNV schrieb:
Dear DD,

tell you what, i havent met Prithvi personally but
i have heard about him. I too am a commercial dealer.
Believe me, we work purely on appointments. And let me
clarify why we do this.
An appointment is infact necessary and beneficial
to the customer. You get personalised attention.
As much time as you want is dedicated to you and
you only. We get to know what your requirement is and
then accordingly we recommend whats ideal. We need info
on things like your room size, budget, music tastes, etc.


This message is also in response to the latest postings by sivat and square_wave. Actually all your latest postings make me feel that I had possibly barged into a dealer's showroom and demanded for an instantaneous demo. Far from true. If you guys fix appointments with customers to better serve the customers and utilize your time better, that the way to do it and is indeed professional approach. Even I take and expect other to have appointments before a meeting. No debating that from my side. But how about a dealer reminding a customer 18 times during a conversation that how fortunate the customer was to get time and that it would not have been possible to get an appointment for months together otherwise. What does the dealer want to prove? That only he is busy and rest of the world is just languishing? Isn't the customer's time equally important? Will the dealers here responding to my concern ever do the same to their customers? You have missed the point guys.


SNV schrieb:

Most of the hifi dealers stock brands they believe in,
so obviously they would promote those labels only.
The golden rule still remains : trust your ears.
One needs to visit few dealers and audition a couple
of brands and then decide what sounds the best to him.
But most definitely the dealer will recommend only the
brands he stocks or can make available.

I would like to state you an example as well:
You go to an electronic showroom looking for a tv.
You shortlist on sony and philips. Now both the tvs
are good, but the dealer tells you that the philips is
better than the sony only because he has a higher margin
on the philips.
Believe me when i say this, every outlet does this.
If you were find this out, you would think you were
misleaded, whereas the dealer still thinks he did
recommend a good tv and he made some money.

Welcome to the real world.


I am fine with this rationale too. How about this example. The dealer has sony and not philips at one time when you visit the showroom. The dealer recommends you that you trust your senses and then decide after thorough comparison. Then when you ask for a comparison between sony and philips, he says there is no point comparing and sony is better because he tells you with his years of experience behind him dealing with the products and recommends you buying sony.
The next time around you go to the same dealer after a couple of months and this time the same story repeats. It's just that the dealer has stock of philips this time and not sony and hence the recommendation changes with the same logic stated earlier.
Moreover, the price quoted would be 100-200% more than the actual product price only because the product isn't plentily available in Bangalore. Is this what you mean by "welcome to real world"? If so, I beg to differ. I am not a dud to be existing in this world with unrealistic expectations.


SNV schrieb:

Maybe you did have bad experience, i dont think anybody
is denying that. Not every client is comfortable with
every dealer. Everyone has their favourites and not so
favourites.

Anyways as Junia quoted, dont get disappointed.
There are a lot of other dealers who would be glad to
help you decide a configuration.

Regards
Jay

Remember what happened to Fiat company in India when their monopoly was broken by Maruti. The same fate awaits P when his ludicrous monopoly is broken. If this trend continues with P, his days are numbered.
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#23 erstellt: 29. Sep 2005, 16:44

sbfx schrieb:
I'll vouch for deaf that he's not P(Prithvi) also I have brought some stuff from Prithvi in the past but never met him I will surely rec him easy to deal with.


Regards,

Satyam.


I would rather wait to hear from deaf. I am interested to know his rational behind taking sides of P based on comments of 2 individuals while claiming that he didn't know anyone in the equation.
kvish
Ist häufiger hier
#24 erstellt: 30. Sep 2005, 01:26
Honestly, I believe that you should judge products by your ears and your wallet! .

Why only Mr P.? (Honestly I dont know P or Prithvi) everyone is trying to push the brands which are either in stock or have higher margins. I can give you one example. I had been to Modern World in Airport road. He has predominantly onkyo and Sony stuff. I saw that he had sonodyne genie and some pandam speakers in one corner too. (I dont think they were even connected). I just enquired how much the genie was. (just to compare how competitive his pricing is.) He immediately lost interest in me. He told me Onkyo speakers are in a different league than sonodyne. and that guy was hell bent on selling onkyo SPEAKERS. Onkyo receivers...understandable...but onkyo speakers...give me a BREAK!. There are far more instances which I can share and surely other pals in the forum can share....but the point is what you observed is not a rare instance.

To be fair with the guys who stock the audio separates (dealers), you can ask them their ratio of footfalls getting converted to orders...it will be very very less....lots of people spend hours together auditioning and may or may not buy the stuff...I am not saying it is wrong to audition ..but thats the reality they face.....so these guys try to pursuade you more when you visit them..

Bottomline, dont get bogged down by these things. Do your research on the internet. Listen to all options and then YOU decide.

BTW, I didnt know this Prithvi was so popular!
Could someone share what he stocks and where he is located?
Jeeves
Stammgast
#25 erstellt: 30. Sep 2005, 04:55
Prithvi Vedpathak
Absolute Phase
48 Cubbon Rd
Bangalore 560001
Tel +91 9844094669
SNV
Stammgast
#26 erstellt: 30. Sep 2005, 07:27
Dear DD,

I thought I made myself pretty clear in my message, anyways here goes:

Ok, first of all I ain’t siding nobody here.


This message is also in response to the latest postings by sivat and square_wave. Actually all your latest postings make me feel that I had possibly barged into a dealer's showroom and demanded for an instantaneous demo. Far from true. If you guys fix appointments with customers to better serve the customers and utilize your time better, that the way to do it and is indeed professional approach. Even I take and expect other to have appointments before a meeting. No debating that from my side. But how about a dealer reminding a customer 18 times during a conversation that how fortunate the customer was to get time and that it would not have been possible to get an appointment for months together otherwise. What does the dealer want to prove? That only he is busy and rest of the world is just languishing? Isn't the customer's time equally important? Will the dealers here responding to my concern ever do the same to their customers? You have missed the point guys.


Just like you, every clients time is precious and so is ours. So if you were reminded time and
again about how fortunate you were to get that appointment, I feel really sorry for you.
I don’t think any dealer can afford to do that, no matter how big he is and if one is
behaving in this unprofessional way, then definitely his days are numbered.




I am fine with this rationale too. How about this example. The dealer has sony and not philips at one time when you visit the showroom. The dealer recommends you that you trust your senses and then decide after thorough comparison. Then when you ask for a comparison between sony and philips, he says there is no point comparing and sony is better because he tells you with his years of experience behind him dealing with the products and recommends you buying sony.
The next time around you go to the same dealer after a couple of months and this time the same story repeats. It's just that the dealer has stock of philips this time and not sony and hence the recommendation changes with the same logic stated earlier.
Moreover, the price quoted would be 100-200% more than the actual product price only because the product isn't plentily available in Bangalore. Is this what you mean by "welcome to real world"? If so, I beg to differ. I am not a dud to be existing in this world with unrealistic expectations.


I think its crystal clear in my example, that it is a general practice almost everywhere.
Dealers will promote brands they stock and make money out of it, period.
There are certain dealers who would just promote what they have whether they believe in the
brand or not. On the other hand there are also quite a few dealers who promote only
those brands they believe in. This is not just restricted to the audio video industry, it’s the
retail industry around the world.
I think you know what I meant by saying “welcome to the real world”


If indeed what you say happened with you, I would probably feel the same way you do.
If I was quoted a price much higher than the market mrp I would feel cheated, no doubt.
Which is why I said that one needs to do some research.

Once again if you aint comfortable, there are other dealers you could deal with. Im sure they would be glad to add
another customer to their list.

Cheers


[Beitrag von SNV am 30. Sep 2005, 07:28 bearbeitet]
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#27 erstellt: 30. Sep 2005, 08:10

kvish schrieb:
Honestly, I believe that you should judge products by your ears and your wallet! .

Why only Mr P.? (Honestly I dont know P or Prithvi) everyone is trying to push the brands which are either in stock or have higher margins. I can give you one example. I had been to Modern World in Airport road. He has predominantly onkyo and Sony stuff. I saw that he had sonodyne genie and some pandam speakers in one corner too. (I dont think they were even connected). I just enquired how much the genie was. (just to compare how competitive his pricing is.) He immediately lost interest in me. He told me Onkyo speakers are in a different league than sonodyne. and that guy was hell bent on selling onkyo SPEAKERS. Onkyo receivers...understandable...but onkyo speakers...give me a BREAK!. There are far more instances which I can share and surely other pals in the forum can share....but the point is what you observed is not a rare instance.


Well said. After this experience, would you ever feel like going to Modern world on airport road? The dealer tried to sell you what he thought was best but you did feel you were being taken for a ride. Same in my case.


kvish schrieb:
BTW, I didnt know this Prithvi was so popular!


There are various ways of gaining popularity. Mother Teresa and Osama Bin Laden could be two possible examples of contrasting ways.
square_wave
Inventar
#28 erstellt: 30. Sep 2005, 08:41
There are no Mother Theresa's in the retail world ! As SNV said, welcome to the 'real world".

As far as any audio dealer is concerned, all products he stocks will be good for any customer unless the customer is very particular about what he wants. If you are not able to tell the dealer the budget and a specific picture of what you are looking for he will push any product that he has lying around. Put yourself in the dealer's shoes..........don't you think you will do the same ? This is true in any retail industry......how is audio different?
I can understand your frustration...most of us have gone through the same at some point. The solution is to learn as much as possible from audiophile friends, web and have some kind of picture on what you want before you visit any dealer/consultant. Then try and tell him/her what you are looking for. Try and be as specific as possible. He may be able to help you out......From my experience; Prithvi is one of the most helpful guys around..............

There are a lot of people who can help you out with what you want even on this forum. Why don’t you post your specifics here ? We can try and help you out. Hell, some of us even could come with you to have a listen also………..why waste time arguing about this any longer ? Let’s use our time for something more worthwhile.
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#29 erstellt: 30. Sep 2005, 13:08

square_wave schrieb:
There are no Mother Theresa's in the retail world ! As SNV said, welcome to the 'real world".

Hell, some of us even could come with you to have a listen also………..why waste time arguing about this any longer ? Let’s use our time for something more worthwhile.


Agreed. No wasting time arguing. But then when you come across an Osama, you usually tend to compare with the other extreme to bring out the difference. I can certainly go with the middle path, I am not asking for saints here. But certainly not people who change colours like a chameleon just to sell what's in immediate stock. If I am asking for a fair evaluation for all the products the dealer deals in, that's not like asking for the moon.
SNV
Stammgast
#30 erstellt: 30. Sep 2005, 13:16

square_wave schrieb:

There are a lot of people who can help you out with what you want even on this forum. Why don’t you post your specifics here ? We can try and help you out. Hell, some of us even could come with you to have a listen also………..why waste time arguing about this any longer ? Let’s use our time for something more worthwhile.


I agree with squarewave, why dont you let us know what is it
you are looking for and im sure a lot of members would love
to help you decide. I assure you of an unbiased recommendation,
that is ofcourse only if you are interested.

Regards
Jay
abhi.pani
Inventar
#31 erstellt: 30. Sep 2005, 14:18

square_wave schrieb:
There are no Mother Theresa's in the retail world ! As SNV said, welcome to the 'real world".

As far as any audio dealer is concerned, all products he stocks will be good for any customer unless the customer is very particular about what he wants. If you are not able to tell the dealer the budget and a specific picture of what you are looking for he will push any product that he has lying around. Put yourself in the dealer's shoes..........don't you think you will do the same ? This is true in any retail industry......how is audio different?
I can understand your frustration...most of us have gone through the same at some point. The solution is to learn as much as possible from audiophile friends, web and have some kind of picture on what you want before you visit any dealer/consultant.


I have been following this thread all the way. At this point of time it seems a bit uncomfortable and awkward to me and hence this post. What the hell, Most of the posts on this thread has been made to justify a dealer's behaviour (Good or Bad). WHY ???? If someone has met with a bad scene of high-end audio, he is bound to form his opinion and even declare it on a forum like this one. We guys instead of condeming such an act are trying to justify the same...I mean what is this going on, if someone goes through this thread alone, he would be hell bent upon thinking that this is a dealer's forum and nothing to do with consumer's interest. Basically I have nothing to do with DD or P. Infact if at all P is Prithvi, then I have to say that I share a good relationship with him. But then this forum is suppposed to be a place for some good uncoloured discussion.
I being a member would strongly say that it is not happening IMO.
square_wave, I agree that you have a good dealership experience with Prithvi (since you assume P as Prithvi) so does that mean he cant do anything wrong/unethical ?? He is also a human, would you deny that.
If it were not P and someone else would we (especially you square_wave) have justified his act ??
How do we know that DD didnt do his homework of going through the net and reading the reviews?? I might have done his homework still this happened !!!! So what next ??

SNV being a commercial member is somewhat justified in expressing his concerns as a dealer but why you square_wave, why do you want Mr.DD to wear a dealer's shoes and think like him ?? That way you mean to say if someone does something wrong then you just wear his shoes and start thinking like him and obviously you will commit the same misdeed so the guy is justified in doing the misdeed ?????

What is this, I dont think its the right way to justify things....we got wear our own shoes man.....
Recently even I had a very bad experience with another dealer in Blore, I was really dissapointed after that (I will post about it later). Should I also wear his shoes and start thinking like him, Man I can just condemn him like S**T and nothing else.

Man, Cosumers GOD not the Dealers (thats what I have read in some of the shops)...


[Beitrag von abhi.pani am 30. Sep 2005, 14:24 bearbeitet]
square_wave
Inventar
#32 erstellt: 30. Sep 2005, 15:22
Abhi,
You are missing the point here. I am not justifying anybody. If you read DD’s initial post carefully, P’s behavior towards DD is a typical attitude you get if you walk into any retail shop. Nothing less, nothing more……..It does not warrant such a post from DD. Bad mouthing without sufficient reason is not very nice on a forum like this. If ‘P’ is Prithvi (there is no other audio dealer on cubbon road), then myself along with host of other audiophiles whom I know have had very good experiences with him.

I agree everybody has rights and I too am a consumer like DD. But being un-fair is what got to me…………..
Arj
Inventar
#33 erstellt: 30. Sep 2005, 16:43
I guess we have covered all that there was to be said here.

so i guess let us all move on to another topic and let this be.. more discussion on this is not going to give us any more information
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#34 erstellt: 01. Okt 2005, 08:06

square_wave schrieb:
Abhi,
You are missing the point here. I am not justifying anybody. If you read DD’s initial post carefully, P’s behavior towards DD is a typical attitude you get if you walk into any retail shop. Nothing less, nothing more……..It does not warrant such a post from DD. Bad mouthing without sufficient reason is not very nice on a forum like this. If ‘P’ is Prithvi (there is no other audio dealer on cubbon road), then myself along with host of other audiophiles whom I know have had very good experiences with him.

I agree everybody has rights and I too am a consumer like DD. But being un-fair is what got to me…………..


If you were so careful in reading my initial post, I assume you were equally careful in reading my subsequent posts, especially clarifying the specific distasteful behavioural experiences with P in response to questions like yours. Here is what I re-iterate.

1) Making a customer feel it is the dealer's time that is only important and not the customer's time by numerous uncalled for reminders.
2) Changing colours like a chameleon in evaluating even the products that are stocked by the dealer and recommending to purchase based on immediate availability.
3) Recommending to trust ones ears and pestering behaviour to buy the ones that are recommended by him. In a nutshell, double standards.
4) Quoting outrageous prices taking advantage of limited availability.

I am not sure if you were careful enough to understand the facts and the sufficient reasons of displeasure I have raised and not unwarranted badmouthing.

I am not here to be nice; I have stated facts.

If you still believe the above is the typical attitude of any dealer and I am being unfair, I am afraid I will have to brand you in the same league as I have branded P.

Hope you are reading this posting of mine carefully enough to realise the logic, rational, facts and data behind my initial posting.

I would sincerely advice you to removed the coloured glass you are wearing and look from a neutral perspective.
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#35 erstellt: 01. Okt 2005, 08:15

Arj schrieb:
I guess we have covered all that there was to be said here.

so i guess let us all move on to another topic and let this be.. more discussion on this is not going to give us any more information


Disagree. I am sure there are people who aren't expressing their views out of fear of exposure. It is our this mentality and attitude of taking cheating and unfairness without questoning (read 'Chalta Hai' attitude) that we always suffer and get bullied and dominated by people like P.
abhi.pani
Inventar
#36 erstellt: 01. Okt 2005, 09:04

square_wave schrieb:
Abhi,
You are missing the point here. I am not justifying anybody. If you read DD’s initial post carefully, P’s behavior towards DD is a typical attitude you get if you walk into any retail shop. Nothing less, nothing more……..It does not warrant such a post from DD. Bad mouthing without sufficient reason is not very nice on a forum like this. If ‘P’ is Prithvi (there is no other audio dealer on cubbon road), then myself along with host of other audiophiles whom I know have had very good experiences with him.

I agree everybody has rights and I too am a consumer like DD. But being un-fair is what got to me…………..


Do you mean Modern World and Absoulute Phase are same when it comes to selling products ??? I beg to differ....
I never recommend people to go to Modern World (atleast for hifi products) but I do recommend people to visit Absolute phase and my recommendation is not based on Prithvi alone or the products alone, its based on the entire aspect of dealer-customer synergy. Dont generalise things which are not meant to be. You are again trying justify a mis-act behind such unwanted generalisations.
abhi.pani
Inventar
#37 erstellt: 01. Okt 2005, 09:36

square_wave schrieb:
Abhi,
I agree everybody has rights and I too am a consumer like DD. But being un-fair is what got to me…………..


square_wave, How many instances have you seen a consumer bein unfair to a dealer....
Cmon man, we are not kids, most of the incidents of unfairness, cheating and trouble are from dealers to consumers and not vice-versa. This is just another instance of the same. Thats why we have "Consumer Courts" in our country and not "Dealer Courts".
kvish
Ist häufiger hier
#38 erstellt: 01. Okt 2005, 13:30
Agree!. I believe that what DD has done is correct in conveying his experience to everyone in the forum.

If I go to Mr P's store for an audition, this is what I will have in mind: (conclusions drawn from this thread)
1. The guy has received positive responses from few members in the forum. I can expect a good "DEMO".
2. Mr P gives substantial time for demos and doesnt hurry up
3. Mr P tries to push his brand too hard.
4. Mr P changes his stance regularly on brands based on internal factors (stock, pricing etc)
5. Mr P's pricing requires cross checking.

So, for a guy like me who hasnt been to Mr P's store these factors are very very helpful. So I take this discussion in as a preliminary feedback which is what internet research is all about.!
Jeeves
Stammgast
#39 erstellt: 01. Okt 2005, 14:30
But kvish until dd tells us who P is , you wont know which store! Your assumptions may not work!
kvish
Ist häufiger hier
#40 erstellt: 01. Okt 2005, 16:37
Hmm.... For reasons of making my earlier post valid let me assume P=Prithvi

Infact I dont see any reason why we should keep anyone's name as secret. If anyone has had bad experiences we should come out in open with all details (Kula-Gotra!)...the forum is more fruitful then!...

Kvish
Krish
Stammgast
#41 erstellt: 03. Okt 2005, 04:24
Satyam,
That avatar of yours is cool.

K
sbfx
Stammgast
#42 erstellt: 03. Okt 2005, 06:11
Thanks Krish

Satyam
manishk13
Ist häufiger hier
#43 erstellt: 03. Okt 2005, 11:35
I am with Abhi and DD. Irrespective of who P is, DD has been very objective in his comments and has every right as a consumer to be p***d off if he did not get the right treatment and has every right to write to on this forum since that is what it is meant for. Lets not make motherhood statements without understanding and appreciating the consumer aspect of what he is saying.

Manish
Anandjacob
Neuling
#44 erstellt: 06. Okt 2005, 20:38
According to my experience, if u dont have technical idea about the product you are going to purchase, the dealer will cheat u by giving wrong information about the product. because 99 % of the dealers are not bothered about the customer satisfaction, but they want to sell their products. So before going to purchase any product, collect the technical information about the product from internet, or friends.

Anand
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#45 erstellt: 11. Okt 2005, 09:02

Anandjacob schrieb:
According to my experience, if u dont have technical idea about the product you are going to purchase, the dealer will cheat u by giving wrong information about the product. because 99 % of the dealers are not bothered about the customer satisfaction, but they want to sell their products. So before going to purchase any product, collect the technical information about the product from internet, or friends.

Anand :?


By the way, this is not my only experince with a dealer. I do not have a bias in favour of or against anyone for me to target a particular dealer. My feedback was purely based on my experience, including the relative experience with other dealers.

Also on the contrary, I came to know about the intentions of the dealer only after doing the necessary research. Else how on earth would I know the gap (better read chasm) in price quoted by the dealer and the retail price?

Why do folks in this forum think that I am complaining about something very usual and that I haven't had any experience with dealers?

I asked some relevant questions to "Square_Wave" in one of my recent responses. I would be glad if anyone in this forum can tell me why that kind of an experience should not be disappointing enough for anyone. A response from square_wave in particular will be highly appreciable.

Last, but not the least, I am still awaiting a response from "deaf". I still cannot comprehend his taking sides without knowing anyone in the equation as per his claims.
deaf
Stammgast
#46 erstellt: 11. Okt 2005, 09:03
Tell you guys this much,P, if he is this Prithvi chap or not, has certainly made this Pritvi a really famous forum dude.Looks like nobody really dislikes him personally, agrees to his business attitude even if they do not know him,and most importantly except DD nobody has called him a creep.So I think DD,if P=Prithvi,you should go give this dude a chance,who knows maybe you met him on a bad day.Thats my way to look at it.
Regards Deaf
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#47 erstellt: 11. Okt 2005, 09:42

deaf schrieb:
Tell you guys this much,P, if he is this Prithvi chap or not, has certainly made this Pritvi a really famous forum dude.Looks like nobody really dislikes him personally, agrees to his business attitude even if they do not know him,and most importantly except DD nobody has called him a creep.So I think DD,if P=Prithvi,you should go give this dude a chance,who knows maybe you met him on a bad day.Thats my way to look at it.
Regards Deaf


As I mentioned earlier, there are 2 ways of getting famous; The Mother Teresa way and The Osama Bin Laden way. As I understand from this forum, it is only the dealers who have supported P and not consumers. I assume consumers are mum due to fear of exposure. Silence from consumers here is taken as an agreement by me. There are also a couple of guys who suck up to P for some obvious reasons.

I don't think I met P on a bad day. But I do certainly know I met P's bad attitude.

As calimed by you, how on earth can someone like anyone's business attitude without knowing or interacting with a person? This explains the reason for your support for P when you claim not knowing him. Did you have a divine dream about P for opining the way you did?

Lastly, what made you wake up now? You are responding with hindsight. Could you still explain the reason for your supporting P at the very onset of this thread when we hardly had any opinion, forget about the dissection of his business attitude. Isn't it reason enough for concluding your thought process as creep?
deaf
Stammgast
#48 erstellt: 11. Okt 2005, 10:04
Dear DD
It seems to me that even consumers are supporting this P chap besides commercial members.All I am saying is that everybody needs a second chance,so you should go and give it a try,thats all.
Regards Deaf
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#49 erstellt: 11. Okt 2005, 10:21

deaf schrieb:
Dear DD
It seems to me that even consumers are supporting this P chap besides commercial members.All I am saying is that everybody needs a second chance,so you should go and give it a try,thats all.
Regards Deaf


Point noted. But how did you know I had only one interaction with P? In fact, I had multiple and all resulting in the same conclusion. It was not just a bad day, it was dismally bad ATTITUDE.
deaf
Stammgast
#50 erstellt: 11. Okt 2005, 10:30

Dare_Devil schrieb:

deaf schrieb:
Dear DD
It seems to me that even consumers are supporting this P chap besides commercial members.All I am saying is that everybody needs a second chance,so you should go and give it a try,thats all.
Regards Deaf


Point noted. But how did you know I had only one interaction with P? In fact, I had multiple and all resulting in the same conclusion. It was not just a bad day, it was dismally bad ATTITUDE.


Dear DD
From your first post on this subject, it looked as if you had only one interaction with P.If there were more then I guess you may have your own valid opinion.But does P=Pritvi?because if it doesn't, then everybody is wasting their time on the subject, as we are all chasing a ghost.The only real beneficiary is Prithvi as everybody on the forum seemingly likes him, and admires him, and respects him,great for the guy without even saying a word on the subject.Love top be in his commercial shoes.
Regards Deaf
Dare_Devil
Stammgast
#51 erstellt: 11. Okt 2005, 10:56

deaf schrieb:

Dear DD
From your first post on this subject, it looked as if you had only one interaction with P.If there were more then I guess you may have your own valid opinion.But does P=Pritvi?because if it doesn't, then everybody is wasting their time on the subject, as we are all chasing a ghost.The only real beneficiary is Prithvi as everybody on the forum seemingly likes him, and admires him, and respects him,great for the guy without even saying a word on the subject.Love top be in his commercial shoes.
Regards Deaf


I never mentioned that I had only one interaction with P. If you inferred that, you do have a coloured thought that's biased towards P. Whether P=Prithvi is for the forum members to decide. I guess people get the intent of my message and do not think this to be a waste of time (at least that's what I understand from the PMs I get). If you do think this to be a waste of your time, you are most welcome to be a mere spectator. No one forced you to read or respond at the first place. If you are so much in awe, admiration and respect of P and are inspired to be in his commercial shoes, you are most welcome to do so. And hope you wouldn't mind such posts either acclaiming you like P.
By the way, it would be great if you could share your experience with P for justifying your enamour for P.
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