Sub-woofer disappointment

Dear Purnendu,

Try to hunt for the REL Storm subwoofer. This is a fast subwoofer and definitely more musical that the Quad.
It is a sealed enclosure design.
The new models of Rel arent that great. Im sure Audio People from Chennai have a few pieces left of the Storm.
See if you can negotiate a good deal as the model has been discontinued.
They could also give you a home demo.

Regards
SNV

SNV do you mean th Storm III ?

i believe only the strata is sealed port..storm onwards are ported..but musical all the same.

but again , it is very possible that the sluggishness could be due to setup . have you tried playing around with the Phase and positioning ?

Arj schrieb:

SNV do you mean th Storm III ? i believe only the strata is sealed port..storm onwards are ported..but musical all the same. but again , it is very possible that the sluggishness could be due to setup . have you tried playing around with the Phase and positioning ?

Dear Arj,

I meant the Storm 5 and its a closed box.

Dear Purnendu,

Setting up the sub in the right manner is often more difficult and buying the right sub.
As Arj mentioned, keep experimenting with the position, phase, gain, frequency roll off.

Regards
SNV

SNV schrieb:

I meant the Storm 5 and its a closed box.

Oh..i did not know that. do you have an idea of the indicative price range of the storm and the strata ?

Arj schrieb:

SNV schrieb: I meant the Storm 5 and its a closed box. Oh..i did not know that. do you have an idea of the indicative price range of the storm and the strata ?

Dear Arj,

Both the models are ofcourse discontinued.
The Stampede, Strata 5 and Storm 5 were all sealed enclosure designs, only the Stadium III was ported.

From what i remember the UK Mrps - Strata 5 was £800 and Storm 5 was £1000.

Regards
SNV

Jay !

Don't you think rather than spending that kind of money on Tablettes & Rel, it would be better to buy a full range speaker e.g. ProAc Studio 140.

I wholeheartedly agree with Sanjay; heard the Proac Studio 140 at his place & found them very satisfying, musically.
Sidvee, who has a wider listening experience than most by virtue of his work as a reviewer for Sounstage, is also looking at PS140 for himself.

well, from what I have heard, the tablette is a level higher than the studio in terms of midrange refinement and treble. the studios bass extension may be better, but not sure if the loss in midrange would be worth it and IMHO the converse may hold more true

i would suggest changing the phase and perhaps moving the sub away from the wall as step 1 and see if the bass is still sluggish. (You may need to increase the gain)

One sequence I have found useful and is quite quick (although not optimal)is

1. put the the gain on the sub as very high ,
2.leave the crossover at the -3db Freq
3 keep moving the phase until the bass is the loudest at the listening position
4. Now reduce the gain until you reach the point where the bass just does not feel obvious. (at this point you will know the sub is present only when you switch it off and hence miss it)

another good advice i have had in the past is after a basic setup (as above) put the sub in the position you will usually sit in your listening and move around on your hands and knees near the speakers (may not be practically possible) untill the bass gets the clearest. that is the best place to put the sub with its current settings.

hope this helps

the "slowness" could also be room boom, which may not be so easy to get rid off and would be present even in floorstanders.

SDhawan schrieb:

Jay ! Don't you think rather than spending that kind of money on Tablettes & Rel, it would be better to buy a full range speaker e.g. ProAc Studio 140.

Absolutely Doc, the Studio 140 is a stunning product (which is why i had recommended the same to you).

Since Purnendu was considering a sub from Quad at 69k, i recommended the Rel Storm 5.
As mentioned earlier the model has been discontinued and he could get a good deal from Audio People.
If he is comfortable, he could get a better price for a demo unit which i think Audio People might just have.
Quite possibly it would be cheaper than the Quad.

Studio 140 is certainly a good upgrade option too (didnt click me)

Regards
SNV

And I was thinking to go in for a Quad L-sub to go with my 11Ls...Purnendu, have you listened to the 11Ls or 12Ls with the L-sub? If so, let me know your experience.

Arj schrieb:

another good advice i have had in the past is after a basic setup (as above) put the sub in the position you will usually sit in your listening and move around on your hands and knees near the speakers (may not be practically possible) untill the bass gets the clearest. that is the best place to put the sub with its current settings.

This is an extremely painful(atleast for people with a back problem, like me), time consuming, irritable and tedious job, but the finest and most effective.
Once done, its a treat and completely worth it. One would thoroughly enjoy his music.
Positioning is extremely critical for a sub. There will be black holes in the room. You need to spend time and find the right spot.

Regards
SNV

panditr schrieb:

And I was thinking to go in for a Quad L-sub to go with my 11Ls...Purnendu, have you listened to the 11Ls or 12Ls with the L-sub? If so, let me know your experience.

Dear Rahul,

Every room is going to sound different. What may work for one can be disastrous for the other.
I would recommend you consider a home demo.
Ideally the Quad sub should gel well with the 11Ls.

Regards
SNV

So SNV,

looks like we all audio retailers have a back problem, sorry to go off topic, but now have a nice german trolley to help in moving things. Have stopped lifting things.

Coming back to the topic:-

The best match with the ProAc Tabs is the ProAc ER-1 sub, same tonality and pretty fast. The Tabs are fantastic speakers.

Heard the Studio 140 with a clients Cyrus pre/pwr and they do make a great combo.

Just my two bit.

Prithvi schrieb:

looks like we all audio retailers have a back problem,

this hobby is quite prone to it..sitting in front of a hifi during spare time is not going to strengthen the back in any way

Nice one Arjun

And if anything remains of the back - the HiFi equipment prices cursh it

So retialers should not be the one to complain.

Prithvi schrieb:

So SNV, looks like we all audio retailers have a back problem, sorry to go off topic, but now have a nice german trolley to help in moving things. Have stopped lifting things.

Kya Kare Sir, We are simply too passionate about audio that we like to do everything ourselves. Though i too now have almost stopped lifting heavy amps and speakers.

Prithvi schrieb:

So SNV, Heard the Studio 140 with a clients Cyrus pre/pwr and they do make a great combo.

So Privthi, when are you planning to sell Cyrus with the Proac's.

Regards
SNV

SDhawan schrieb:

And if anything remains of the back - the HiFi equipment prices cursh it So retialers should not be the one to complain. :L

Doctor Saab,

We are merely complaining about lifting and moving hifi gear.
Gosh, there is a lot of better stuff to lift and move, sadly its just hifi gear for us.

Also, the biggest irony remains that we still cant afford to buy for ourselves the very same hifi products that we sell to you and this is will always remain our complain.
Trust me, hifi business is not very lucrative. Most of us are in it for the passion.

Regards
SNV

Hi All,
Thanks for the responses. Was busy hence did not get back.

About the REL. Its a good idea and had been on my mind too, but there is no dealer here who can give me an audition. Its very important for a sub especially. May be I could not give positioning enough time and attention, but two and a half days is a fair amount of listening time. Its also backbreaking, as other have attested. I suspect that Prithivi is probably right about the ER1, but thats an expensive proposition. It may in fact be best to hang in there and upgrade the main speakers. As it happens however the mainspeakers are the last thing I need to upgrade. As and when I do it would have to be something in the Response lineup not the Studio. The Tablette is a fantastic little speaker and I am not parting with it fast. Rahul, I have heard the quad sub with the quad speakers. They sounded very good, which is why I decided to listen to it. I am pretty sure you would not be unhappy with the combo. Unfortunately the tabs are in different league from the quads.

After this experience I have done some rethinking, and at present am more inclined to believe that upgrading my sources will give me more satisfaction. The tabs can take a lot better sources and amplification than I have at my disposal now. Lets see what way I can go, funds permitting.

Purnendu

I think your decision not to add a sub is a sound one-much better to upgrade the main speakers.
Do keep posting re your search for a better source.

Dear Purnendu,

Another option, if at all you wish to consider.

MJ Acoustics Prosub50 mk2 and the Reference 100 mk2.
MJ Acoustics i feel is the only other company that comes close to the Rel.

Regards
SNV