Cadence VA1.0 & Cadence Arita

hi vpriyan,

it will be awesome for jazz, classical. the amp is round 75k, the divas 63k the aritas must be up to round 45k. they were 31k plus taxes some time back. the amp also must be priced higher by now. though for that kind of money maybe u can get a class a tube amp from someone else? or abroad? the dealer is oceanic in pune. check out the site cadenceaudio for details.

I second that....the combo would just be great for jazz....BTW Its oceanic or cadence direct for pune, J&B sound(linking road) for bombay.

MAnek.

BTW the Arita is a 86-87db at 8 ohms speaker and the diva 88db at 8 ohms so a small class A tube amp may not produce the very high spl....would recommend 35 watts and above....what is your listening area ?

Manek.

Dear Sir,
In the Cadence stable,the standmount is better than the floorstander among the dynamic models.
Regards Deaf.

Unfortunately, Cadence has hiked the prices of all its models by a huge percentage. Now foreign brands like Magnepan might well be better buys. I like the MG12.

Manek, I'm surprised that valve amps can drive the low-sensitivity Cadence models. Are there some compromises? Or would Bryston or Audio Analogue solid state amps be better buys?

Neutral schrieb:

Unfortunately, Cadence has hiked the prices of all its models by a huge percentage. Now foreign brands like Magnepan might well be better buys. I like the MG12. Manek, I'm surprised that valve amps can drive the low-sensitivity Cadence models. Are there some compromises? Or would Bryston or Audio Analogue solid state amps be better buys?

Dear Neutral
Here is an interesting point,I have never,never in all these years heard the VA1.0 drive anything but a cadence speaker except a small PMC many many years ago.The speakers sound the best with the Cadence amp than with any other electronics in a comparable price.I think the amp tracks the speaker impedence by design, hence the match is perfect.
Regards Deaf.

Neutral schrieb:

Unfortunately, Cadence has hiked the prices of all its models by a huge percentage. Now foreign brands like Magnepan might well be better buys. I like the MG12. Manek, I'm surprised that valve amps can drive the low-sensitivity Cadence models. Are there some compromises? Or would Bryston or Audio Analogue solid state amps be better buys?

Neutral,

Tube amps can easily drive speakers with efficiency of 86-87+db all that one needs to take care of is the impedance curve if its not dropping 7-6.5ohms you are gold


Regards,

Satyam

[quote=Dear Neutral
Here is an interesting point,I have never,never in all these years heard the VA1.0 drive anything but a cadence speaker except a small PMC many many years ago.The speakers sound the best with the Cadence amp than with any other electronics in a comparable price.I think the amp tracks the speaker impedence by design, hence the match is perfect.
Regards Deaf.[/quote]

Very true. Cadence amps and speakers are a great match. However sometimes the spks sound great with better hi-current amps. I think cadence amps & spks together sound the best as Shanti their designer has designed them so. Even Steve Harris of Hi-Fi News mentioned many years back that Cadence sounds best with their own amps in one of the issues.

Rgds

Prithvi

Hi Folks,
From your experience could you give me an idea of how much power woul a valve amp need to drive a load with about 88 sensitivity. Room size fifteen by twenty feet. I have in mind something like the high quality Monitor Audio Gold series GR10 speakers. Would a 20 or 25 watt amp suffice. The speaker brochure recommend a 100 watt amplifier. That would be very difficult and expensive to get from a valve set up. Has any of you heard this speaker.
Purnendu

purnendu schrieb:

Hi Folks, From your experience could you give me an idea of how much power woul a valve amp need to drive a load with about 88 sensitivity.....

It really depends on what genre of music you prefer and how loud you like it being played. A 70’s vintage Sony towers which measures approx 87dB is driven quite ok with a 12wpc 811A SET.

You may like to investigate an EL34 or KT66 Push Pull amp. Should drive your speakers to quite high listening levels with room to spare. Just ensure that the output stage in UL wired and not Triode strapped.

Regarding the much vaunted Cadence EL34 amp, I have some comments but then I will be flamed-out big time from this forum. So we shall let it just pass. I have heard one at Oceanic (Pune) thro kind courtesies of Mahendra Dave. This was about 4 years ago.

I like forum member Viren’s approach better. His homepage doesn’t give full details, but I assume he is using a more traditional topology and I personally prefer that. MOSFET drivers / Phase Splitter, as used by Cadence, may provide a more linear response though but still……

purnendu schrieb:

Hi Folks, From your experience could you give me an idea of how much power woul a valve amp need to drive a load with about 88 sensitivity. Room size fifteen by twenty feet. I have in mind something like the high quality Monitor Audio Gold series GR10 speakers. Would a 20 or 25 watt amp suffice. The speaker brochure recommend a 100 watt amplifier. That would be very difficult and expensive to get from a valve set up. Has any of you heard this speaker. Purnendu

Hi Purnendu,
Never was as convinced about the MA gold series.Something about their overall spectral balance is quite unsettling.At the price look at the Dyn 52SE,the Cadence standmount,the Energy V2.2, PSB Stratus mini.I think you should ask Benks about more Bangalore based local manufactures too, as he is in constant knowledge about them it seems.He could advise you about their product lines too.Also take a look at the Rethm from Kerela, the 5th Rethm in particular.They do not go very low, but you have a 20'x15' room,which could have some bass issues and the limited bass of the 5th could actually be a blessing.This speaker will be driven by a flea powered tube amp so it may actually solve your quest.This speaker is a love it or loathe it device, so hear it carefully before you make up your mind.
Regards Deaf.

Hi and Thanks for the feedback,
I am running a Lyrita integrated amp which is rated at about 20 watts. Its good enough for my needs. My CD and speakers have aged. I was planning to upgrade the speakers first and was looking at options. Viren has a full range speaker at a reasonable price. Its better much than my 780s but the tweeters lack refinement and the bass is a little sluggish. I happend to listen to the Jamo D590 recently and found it to be an attractive and balanced speaker at an unreasonable price (Rs. 90,000). My budget stands at 50,000. I heard the Dynaudios at Prithvi, and liked them but again the price was 90,000. Or maybe it was a different model. I had written to George of Rethm and he quoted me a price of Rs. 50,000 for the Rethm 5. This sounds reasonable and I like the idea of a single driver. Has anyone heard it? I dont mind sacrificing some bass for good midrange, but how much? I also talked to Viren and he is working on a Fostex based single driver transmission line design. My main constraint with single driver designs is their size. I would prefer to have speaskers the size of the dynaudios and the monitor audio gr10s.

The music I listen to is mainly western classical (Symphonies, chamber music some choral and songs)and Jazz. Sometimes I listen loud. I also like Indian classical, some Afro-Am and Rock leftovers from younger days.

There has been one serious new problem that has come my way and may force a change in my speaker upgrade plans. My old reliable Sony Es 333 CD player has just stopped working more or less. It may just well be that I have to plonk the money on a CD player. However that may be, it would be good to get some clarity about what speakers I should consider.

Purnendu

purnendu schrieb:

Hi and Thanks for the feedback, I am running a Lyrita integrated amp which is rated at about 20 watts. Its good enough for my needs. My CD and speakers have aged. I was planning to upgrade the speakers first and was looking at options. Viren has a full range speaker at a reasonable price. Its better much than my 780s but the tweeters lack refinement and the bass is a little sluggish. I happend to listen to the Jamo D590 recently and found it to be an attractive and balanced speaker at an unreasonable price (Rs. 90,000). My budget stands at 50,000. I heard the Dynaudios at Prithvi, and liked them but again the price was 90,000. Or maybe it was a different model. I had written to George of Rethm and he quoted me a price of Rs. 50,000 for the Rethm 5. This sounds reasonable and I like the idea of a single driver. Has anyone heard it? I dont mind sacrificing some bass for good midrange, but how much? I also talked to Viren and he is working on a Fostex based single driver transmission line design. My main constraint with single driver designs is their size. I would prefer to have speaskers the size of the dynaudios and the monitor audio gr10s. The music I listen to is mainly western classical (Symphonies, chamber music some choral and songs)and Jazz. Sometimes I listen loud. I also like Indian classical, some Afro-Am and Rock leftovers from younger days. There has been one serious new problem that has come my way and may force a change in my speaker upgrade plans. My old reliable Sony Es 333 CD player has just stopped working more or less. It may just well be that I have to plonk the money on a CD player. However that may be, it would be good to get some clarity about what speakers I should consider. Purnendu

It was the Audience 52se's that you heard at my place, As Deaf suggests, try the 5th rethm.
Rgds

Prithvi

hmm..didn't know that Peerless(Tymphany) made full range drivers.

benkenobi schrieb:

hmm..didn't know that Peerless(Tymphany) made full range drivers.

Dear Benks
Peerless India, not DST.
Regards Deaf.

Neutral,
Nothing surprising in valve amps driving cadence speakers...they were made with that in mind only...for a nomal Indian room the valve amp combo and any of the cadence speakers are more than enough.....you could drive the cadence speakers with a lot of other amps, arcam and cadence gel very well as well....I've heard them powered with classe, rowland, integra, roksan, quad, nad, etc....to be quite honest they seem to work well with all of them I've heard.


Deaf....you are right, the Arita is the better of the two dynamic speakers...by a long shot !

Manek.

Hey screamgigi, could you please tell us more about what you feel about the cadence EL34 tube amp ? It would be helpful for all as you are so much into tubes. I listened to Viren’s tube amp (30watt/ch) at forum member Arjeet’s place. I am pretty new to tubes but I was impressed. He has Viren’s towers and a project turntable.

Hi,

I am biased, but I will discuss another manufacturers product from a design point of view.

The Cadence EL34 valve amp uses solid-state circuitry in the input stage, and valves in the output stage. If I were to make a hybrid amp, I would reverse the design - valves in the input, and transistors in the output. Valves are naturally suited for handling low level signals, and are more linear in their operating range. All input circuits run in class A bias anyway, so there are no zero-crossing distortions. The output transistors then provide the muscle to the speakers. I fail to understand why Cadence chose their design as they did.

In my opinion, transistors have no role in valve amps- other than as voltage or current regulators. The very reason to design valve amps is to use the inherent linearity of valves as amplifying devices. And these amps reproduce music more realistically, and with more clarity, than solid-state amps ever will. Why strangle a valve amp with solid-state devices in the signal path?

Viren.

viren schrieb:

Hi, I am biased, but I will discuss another manufacturers product from a design point of view. The Cadence EL34 valve amp uses solid-state circuitry in the input stage, and valves in the output stage. If I were to make a hybrid amp, I would reverse the design - valves in the input, and transistors in the output. Valves are naturally suited for handling low level signals, and are more linear in their operating range. All input circuits run in class A bias anyway, so there are no zero-crossing distortions. The output transistors then provide the muscle to the speakers. I fail to understand why Cadence chose their design as they did. In my opinion, transistors have no role in valve amps- other than as voltage or current regulators. The very reason to design valve amps is to use the inherent linearity of valves as amplifying devices. And these amps reproduce music more realistically, and with more clarity, than solid-state amps ever will. Why strangle a valve amp with solid-state devices in the signal path? Viren.

Very well put Viren,I appreciate your knowledge in electronics,but I also know that Shanti is a true guru from first hand experience.His amplifier topology has now become common among other manufacturers, but was rare 10 years ago.The Cadence amp in its 18-20 watt version sounds magnificent with the older Cadence speakers ,notably the ES, later called the Amaya, and overshadowed many an amplifier in A/B comparisons.My only reservation was QC with regards to Cadence products which still upsets me many a occasion.
However design wise still a fantastic product.
Regards Deaf

[Quote Very well put Viren,I appreciate your knowledge in electronics,but I also know that Shanti is a true guru from first hand experience.His amplifier topology has now become common among other manufacturers, but was rare 10 years ago.The Cadence amp in its 18-20 watt version sounds magnificent with the older Cadence speakers ,notably the ES, later called the Amaya, and overshadowed many an amplifier in A/B comparisons.My only reservation was QC with regards to Cadence products which still upsets me many a occasion.
However design wise still a fantastic product.
Regards Deaf[/quote]

Absolutely correct Viren. I agree with deaf that the old va-1 (20w) is far superior than the present va-1hp. A lot of clients who have the old va-1 and the ES swear by the sound, sadly as deaf mentioned, the QC & After sales service in down in the dumps. I just wish they do something about it & their attitude and they will have a winner.

viren schrieb:

Hi, In my opinion, transistors have no role in valve amps- other than as voltage or current regulators. The very reason to design valve amps is to use the inherent linearity of valves as amplifying devices. And these amps reproduce music more realistically, and with more clarity, than solid-state amps ever will. Why strangle a valve amp with solid-state devices in the signal path? Viren.

Hi Viren, am not really knowledgeable at the design level.. but the point is interesting.
From a laymans point of view, SS is by nature more accurate while valves coloured but more emotionally satisfying.

If we consider low power amps, would it not make more sense to have as much detail as possible till the last stage , at which point it may lose detail but add "Ambience" than the other way around ?

There are varying opinions on whether the pre or the power should be solid state. This has been debated by many reviewers with good points on both sides.

Is watts for a valve amp measured the same way as watts for a solid state amp or is current also an issue to be considered. If 20 + 20 W is enough for 300 sq. ft, then why do people make 100 to 200 W / ch amps?

Cadence is great amplifier and any comments otherwise may look like pot-shots. I wish we could do this via PM.

First of all Cadence is a “Hybrid”. But its got the right part in the wrong end. The idea is to deploy the inherent goodness of both technologies in the most appropriate place. Viren has already presented the underlying principle. Year ago I too experimented with mixed topologies. Results were always a compromise and in the end I returned to an all-valve line for simplicity and reduced parts count. You may dismiss me as an old foggy watching the world walk past.. But some things are better left unchanged..

Deaf:
Shanti is a certified guru. Nobody is going to take that away. He is personal god to many. But I don’t think he invented the hybrid amp. I am willing to be corrected on this.

So are Hybrids better? Apparently not if you go by the limited option available in the market, although it is cheaper to build one.

I can think of eliminating a valve at phase splitting stage. That would require an expensive splitter transformer. But frankly at Cadence cost I cant fathom why they would not use a transformer. They would still make a profit.

I have no connection with Viren but his costs reflect a better value for money.

ARJ:

Any device can sound ‘coloured’ if used improperly (or properly – if you may wish) in an audio design. SS can sound clinical; so can a tube. The big difference is the measured performance but then this is an endless debate.

Neutral:
Good question! Any statement will lead to more debates

I think we should ask folks who buy 400wps monster amps, do you always listen to all those watts? Ok I can think of headroom but then how much do you really need?

Dear Screamgigi,
Shanti did not invent the hybrid amp,but the way he used ICs to constantly bais the tubes was quite innovative.At a time when tube amp companies used to talk about matched set of tubes and the like, his amps could use any combination of EL84 tubes and still sound great.Hear the Canasya, and he is a certified audio guru,hell it even knocked the socks off Jean Hiraga of Review de Son,(that is one reviewer you cant buy).So I guess he knows his stuff.
Regards Deaf.

Jacob of Rethm has also designed a hybrid.He used it to power the Rethms in the last show, if you guys remember.

What is his philosophy ? Any idea ?

K

Krish schrieb:

Jacob of Rethm has also designed a hybrid.He used it to power the Rethms in the last show, if you guys remember. What is his philosophy ? Any idea ? K

Dear Krish
The amp you talk about is designed by somebody else in Kerela.Jacob has worked on the looks aspect of the design.
Regards Deaf.

Hi Deaf:

Thanks for bring up that. I am sure you know your stuff, but for the benefit of other who may not be so familiar with valves, lets just put a little bit of tech info here. I hope you don’t mind.

There is a great deal of difference between a Hybrid amp and a Tube amp that uses SS devices for auto biasing. A SS CCS does wonder to functioning of tube. But in the Cadence you have actually replaced the entire voltage amp and phase splitter section with SS devices.

Also, using SS for auto biasing is not a new thing. I have see Japanese tube amp schematics from the 60’s which used Toshiba devices for providing a constant bias. In practice this call for a couple of transistor and a few resistors/capacitors. I have done this and come back to the traditional approach.

This is for Cathode Biasing scheme. In any case a high class PP tube output stage will employ Fixed Bias. In this case, you are free to choose your operating point. More importantly you eliminate the Electrolytic bypass capacitor throu which your audio signal must pass in case of Cathode (or auto biasing) scheme. The biggest disadvantage of Fixed Biasing scheme is the need to periodically check and adjust bias. Better amps, such as the Marantz 8, have individual pots and meter for each tube and adjusting bias is a jiffy. Most modern PP amp provide test points and all you need is a cheap multimeter to check the voltage and adjust. Some manufacturer also give a free multimeter

I will personally prefer a Fixed Bias topology. You get better sound, you don’t waste a few volts across the Cathode resistors (translate into a few watts more output power) and to an extent you are free to choose your operating point. And quite frankly, if your design is right, a tube mismatch of upto 20% hardly produces any audible sonic drawback. You will of-course be able to measure the increased IMD. Tube guru Viren can throw better light.

Lets clarify one thing here. I never said that Cadence is a bad sounding amp. It’s just different and you can’t call it a full blooded tube amp. And my strong personal feeling is against the high list price. I have seen the fit and finish and the components which go into building one. Just not value for money. But I guess in an industry segment where high cost=high perceived ownership ‘snob’ factor, Cadence has got their strategy right. This is strictly my personal opinion.

I think we getting too tech heavy and turning off other posters. Please feel free to PM me if you wish to conduct this off-line.

Regards

/screamgigi: diving into trenches to avoid incoming flames from Cadence fans

screamgigi....you can run ...but you cant hide

hey, its your opinion....and you are entitled to one

Manek.

screamgigi schrieb:

Hi Deaf: Thanks for bring up that. I am sure you know your stuff, but for the benefit of other who may not be so familiar with valves, lets just put a little bit of tech info here. I hope you don’t mind. There is a great deal of difference between a Hybrid amp and a Tube amp that uses SS devices for auto biasing. A SS CCS does wonder to functioning of tube. But in the Cadence you have actually replaced the entire voltage amp and phase splitter section with SS devices. Also, using SS for auto biasing is not a new thing. I have see Japanese tube amp schematics from the 60’s which used Toshiba devices for providing a constant bias. In practice this call for a couple of transistor and a few resistors/capacitors. I have done this and come back to the traditional approach. This is for Cathode Biasing scheme. In any case a high class PP tube output stage will employ Fixed Bias. In this case, you are free to choose your operating point. More importantly you eliminate the Electrolytic bypass capacitor throu which your audio signal must pass in case of Cathode (or auto biasing) scheme. The biggest disadvantage of Fixed Biasing scheme is the need to periodically check and adjust bias. Better amps, such as the Marantz 8, have individual pots and meter for each tube and adjusting bias is a jiffy. Most modern PP amp provide test points and all you need is a cheap multimeter to check the voltage and adjust. Some manufacturer also give a free multimeter I will personally prefer a Fixed Bias topology. You get better sound, you don’t waste a few volts across the Cathode resistors (translate into a few watts more output power) and to an extent you are free to choose your operating point. And quite frankly, if your design is right, a tube mismatch of upto 20% hardly produces any audible sonic drawback. You will of-course be able to measure the increased IMD. Tube guru Viren can throw better light. Lets clarify one thing here. I never said that Cadence is a bad sounding amp. It’s just different and you can’t call it a full blooded tube amp. And my strong personal feeling is against the high list price. I have seen the fit and finish and the components which go into building one. Just not value for money. But I guess in an industry segment where high cost=high perceived ownership ‘snob’ factor, Cadence has got their strategy right. This is strictly my personal opinion. I think we getting too tech heavy and turning off other posters. Please feel free to PM me if you wish to conduct this off-line. Regards /screamgigi: diving into trenches to avoid incoming flames from Cadence fans :)

Hi Screamgigi,

Thanks for throwing light on the way the amp works makes a little sense to me as im not very versed technically but its great info.

Btw I'm a great fan of the Canasya and agree that its a very exp amp maybe not worth the price but never the less I love it.

Hopefully I someday have the pleasure of listing to your amps sir.

Regards,

Satyam.

Hi Screamgigi,

The technical part of your posts I cannot comment on. The commercial observations do pull me in to this thread.

I too wondered about the pricing of Cadence. Especially the Amps. I suppose they sound divine et. al., but being a manufacturing professional I just could not figure out how an aggregate using standard (outdated ) components can cost so much!! I read somewhere that they have a German in the team. Assuming that the guy get's paid in Euro's and gets the unionised automekanica wage, at 36 hrs a week, and assembles only one Amp per month, it's still too bloody expensive!!!

While on the Amp, the fit and finish is pathetic. It looks like it's been made from the old trunk scrap and assembled in some garage in Khedgaon!!! Or is it a deliberate retro design?

http://www.cadenceaudio.com/productfr.html

Before you guys get the wrong notion, I haven't said anything about the technical aspects of the product as I am not qualified in that area, and..... I won't get dragged in to that discussion!!!!!

Roshan.

P.S Make some room for me in that trench!

Roshan...the German you refer to is an Austrian. Name Walter Schmidt. He is no assembler He is their chief designer and probably a shareholder in the company.

It is a retro design. Some love it some dont. About the fit and finish, The few I have seen are pretty well done.

About the price? yes, its expensive but so are most of the others amps in the market(baring a few exceptions)....the indian consumer generaqlly ends up paying a whole lot more.....

Manek.

Dear Screamgigi,
I never mentioned your opinion on the amp sound.Secondly I myself have some issues with fit and finish and overall QC.
The only point where I may have a disagreement with other memebers is that,cost of parts etc cannot judge the value of an amp or any audio component, in a purely subjective field like ours,where value is based on performance.If I like the sound I am willing to pay for it,I don't care what goes in it,that is called perceived value,not how much it cost to make.I have had the opportunity to work in audio companies in all aspects of the business,manufacturing,distribution and retail too.I learnt this, that unless the end product does not retail at least 5-6 times the cost of manufacturing,that company is not going to succesed commercially.I know all the knowledgeable members are going to go for my head when I say this,but the fact remains if you so prize this hobby,then the guys who manufacture stuff have their personal aspirations too,and he is not going to give it cheap to us just because we think it is not worth the asking money.No successful audio company has sold products at a low margins,whatever their size,that is the reason that garage operations,who try to be price cutters will either shut down or will always remain garage operations.
I respect your knowledge in electronics,but even you must agree, commercially the fact remains that though it has taken 12-15 years, Cadence remains the only true Indian high end company(not a small garage operation) depite all its excess baggage.This has been a good thread,thanks to every ones keen participation.
Regards Deaf.

Well cost Vs Price is not a debate we should be getting into, as if we paid purely by cost Coke would only be 1 Re a bottle

My thoughts tend to agree with Roshans view quite well as I too am commenting without having actually heard / seen the amp in real life.

Without getting into ability to pay and desire to pay, only way to compare it is by a subjective comparison with "Peers" (Again a subjective comparison !)

But if you pay a premium for something, you expect not just a wonderful design but a good Finish AND a wonderful Quality... How different would it be from a DIY guy copying a design otherwise ?. but i can understand the economies of scale not working well for Cadence

personally I have always heard only good things about Cadence products from a "sound" perspective for the past 2-3 years and not just in this forum.., but the negative point always mentioned was quality ! and honestly that scares me,

In spite of not having any proof, with the cost I would not want to take a risk ! and hence was worried about considering it . (Again that was my logic, others will have a different criterion to judge)

..And screamingigi, while you are at it, please make the trench slightly bigger

Hi,
I was going through the various comments/suggestions by various members regarding CADENCE. In my opinion a manufacturer of similar equipment need not comment on the design of Cadence.If he feels that he can do better, he should manufacture better equipment- which will reflect in sales,AND OF COURSE IN SOUND OUTPUT,surely. In which case there will not be any need to comment on the design of Cadence.
About others commenting regarding finishing - for the quality of sound and longivity(as against the cost of the equipment) the aesthetics are neat.
Auto biasing (in a country where tubes themselves are a rarity) is a boon.
I am proud that this equipment is manufactured in India-
it is comparable to the best equipment manufactured anywhere.
I do hope that many more Indian made products of such high quality become visible.
My previous experience of forum discussions led me to believe that these discussions are to help persons in search .Not indulging in (the old joke about the )habits of crabs- which are transported in open buckets- because they pull each other down!!
There is a huge market out there- it would be nice to see
many manufacturers at various levels - built up so that the general public at all levels gets to enjoy music/sound quality of which they were not aware.
Regards Saradindu Bose.

Saradindu,

You should go out and listen to the products of a lot of small Indian companies who are making excellent audio components. A little effort may be required on your part. As I understand, it takes some effort to listen to Cadence products too.

These companies do not have as high a profile as Cadence, and they serve only the Indian market. But the effort and quality that goes into their products is no less. Somehow, intellectual prowness is not the priviledge of just a select few.

For your information, I have had the Cadence amplifier for an audition in my home, and have listened to it extensively. I do not make my statements very lightly.

Viren.

Hi,
Small Indian or even other companies who make excellent audio components are welcome and should definitely be encouraged.
Audiophiles will not,I'm sure,be lacking for effort- what they need to know is what these components are and where they can be auditioned. Moreover, it is also confidence building, (in the absence of formal advertising- which is expensive) if locally based audiophiles would post their comments on their auditions (not even purchases).
The Indian market is huge,I'm sure,and its intellectual prowess (and tastes) diverse and not to be underestimated.
There will be a massive market for products of every range-but the public need to know of availiabilities of every range and the major advantages of each - sound,looks,cost,availability,service etc- each buyer has reasons for purchasing any product.Diversity is the wonder here ,so everyone should present their positives (and not only their perception of the negatives of others).
I do hope that we shall come to know of the positives of the many products available and that this forum will be one of many tools for the dissemination of this knowledge.
Regards
Saradindu Bose.

sbose schrieb:

The Indian market is huge,I'm sure,and its intellectual prowess (and tastes) diverse and not to be underestimated. There will be a massive market for products of every range-but the public need to know of availiabilities of every range and the major advantages of each - sound,looks,cost,availability,service etc- each buyer has reasons for purchasing any product.Diversity is the wonder here ,so everyone should present their positives (and not only their perception of the negatives of others). Saradindu Bose.

I donot mean to offend anyone, but i would really be interested to know what makes you feel that there is a huge market in India.

I hardly think so. It is still in a very nascent stage.
If you step into any big Electronics(the mass market, Sony, Phillips,etc) store am sure you will know what i mean.

sbose schrieb:

,so everyone should present their positives (and not only their perception of the negatives of others).

Well if this were th case, I would prefer to read the marketing brochures.. why come to a forum ?

On this topic , my friend,I differ from your thoughts right at the conceptual level.

A forum is a free for all exchange of Ideas/ views/ opinions and every one having fair chance to put in their point of view.
if I ask Q about a component and only get a rave +ve point..Id rather ask the question in another forum like AA where i would get both views.

Yeah, this is the place to express opinions. It can be Positive or Negative. Remember most of the people are not going take the expressions as postulate. They are personal opinions and in many cases are valid but you just can't assume it is the ultimated opinion.

So let the opinions flow.

sbose the market may be huge but its more the potential market. the actual market is miniscule going by the number of people who appreciate the finer nuances of a music system.

and there are maufacturers who are putting their money where their mouth is. viren from delhi, arasuk and siva from bangalore, jacob george of rethm from kerala. and i'm forgetting the guy from bandra, bombay who makes speakers...

one thing u are right about. there is a huge potential market and at least for the home front, most of the manufacturers could do with a few ideas on how to upgrade people from the average system to a separates rack. i don't mean it in a derogatory way i really wish these guys would promote themselves more actively. most of it seems to be word of mouth right now

nd i'm forgetting the guy from bandra, bombay who makes speakers...

You mean Pandam, or Telome?

neither shahrukh.. i mean the speakers with the q technology. i still can't get the name. if i remember roshan on the forum has them noa is the name of the bookshelf speakers... very neutral sound and value for money say those who've heard it

lithos. got it finally whew.