Wharfedale 8.4 and Rotel RA 01 - wud u recommend?

Very good choices buddy...

Good amp and budget speaker but I am doubtful if the 40watts per channel would be enough to drive the speakers. The 86 db 8.4’s are pretty power hungry. Go for a RA02 or pick up a NAD C320 bee and good spk cables.

square_wave schrieb:

Good amp and budget speaker but I am doubtful if the 40watts per channel would be enough to drive the speakers. The 86 db 8.4’s are pretty power hungry. Go for a RA02 or pick up a NAD C320 bee and good spk cables.

Is that so? The Decibel guy (Anand) told me that RA02 was in fact a RA01 with remote and costs Rs 6000 more.

How do you rate Polk Monitor 50 or 60 and Denon PMA 495R against the above config?

Thx

stay away from the Polk ..

raftuq schrieb:

square_wave schrieb: Good amp and budget speaker but I am doubtful if the 40watts per channel would be enough to drive the speakers. The 86 db 8.4’s are pretty power hungry. Go for a RA02 or pick up a NAD C320 bee and good spk cables. Is that so? The Decibel guy (Anand) told me that RA02 was in fact a RA01 with remote and costs Rs 6000 more. How do you rate Polk Monitor 50 or 60 and Denon PMA 495R against the above config? Thx

Polk + Denon is not for Classical, its all for rock/pop.

AFA I know, Anand has told you the right thing, the only difference between them is that RA-02 comes with a remote. They should be able to drive the 8.4s comfortably. You may even want to check out RA-03 if you have the budget. Rotels are very well suited for rock, if that's your music.

I would suggest against Monitor 60 and Denon stereo amp combo...they both were on too bright to my ears.

Check out NAD 320 BEE as suggested by Square_wave along with PSB speakers. Also check out Marantz stereo amps.

Savyasaachi schrieb:

stay away from the Polk ..

Gee, thanks, one down, two more to go...

I also have Sonodyne 2605 and Jamo 406 on my list, how do these compare with Wharfedale?

Is the wharfedale 8.4 /Rotel RA 01 combo the best buy for a budget of Rs40K?

Thx

Marantz + Wharfdale will give you one of the best sound for classical music. Try Marantz PM-4400...should be under your budget.

abhi.pani schrieb:

Marantz + Wharfdale will give you one of the best sound for classical music. Try Marantz PM-4400...should be under your budget.

Thanks much. Would someone know where I could find Marantz in Bangalore?

hi raftuq,

I am disposing off my marantz pm 8000 amp and wharfdale speakers. r u interested?

soulforged schrieb:

Check out NAD 320 BEE as suggested by Square_wave along with PSB speakers. Also check out Marantz stereo amps.

NAD, PSB - Would you know if these are available at Bangalore?

nietzsche schrieb:

hi raftuq, I am disposing off my marantz pm 8000 amp and wharfdale speakers. r u interested?

If you are at BLR, then I definitely am interested. Let me know...

raftuq schrieb:

Is that so? The Decibel guy (Anand) told me that RA02 was in fact a RA01 with remote and costs Rs 6000 more. Thx

He is perfectly right and they are the same in power. Since sensitivity is not the only component which drives power you should be OK.

Also Rotel are very conservative with power and it is about as powerful as a NAD320 with more than double its rating in reserves.

If you have listened to it and are happy its good for you

hi raftuq,

Yes. U r welcome. Please check ur private message.

regards

NAD & PSB are available with ARN Systems. They have a showroom in Sigma Mall in Cunningham Rd.

Marantz is available with Audio Planet in Koramangala behind BDA.

Again, Jamo may not be the best option given the choice...

A good combo. I personally feel Marantz/Wharfedale make a better combination. A Lot of warmth (and class, if I may say so). Big bang for your buck. I see you've posted the same query in ecoustics too!

I bow to all thee knowledgeable souls for your precious advice, thanks.

I had almost decided on Wharfedale/Rotel, but since some of you speak highly of Marantz, I would now consider that too.

Also how are Mordaunt Avant 904 compared to Wharfedale 8.4? The price is about the same. I haven't heard the Mordaunt's yet (Audio Planet is under renovation till Monday).

Brother Nietzsche, how old is your Marantz 8000 and how's the condition (is there still a warranty on it)? Would you recommend combining it with the above speakers (Wharfedale 8.4)?

Shahrukh Bhai, yes, I posted on ecoustics too; the fun has begun. Actually I believe that researching is equally rewarding and part of the destination is the journey. To tell you the truth, I really dont want to hurry this acquisition (you dont get to do it every day)and am soaking in all the good advice coming in.

Marantz would be more suited for your choice of music (Indian classical) so do give it a shot. MS again are pretty laid back speakers, so they would also suit ur music. I haven't heard the 904 but it supposed to be the floorstanding version of 902 which is a very good speaker. Are you really sure you want to go for floorstanders? In a 10X10 (square) room, you might get a better sound out of bookshelves and also have the flexibility of placing them almost anywhere you want.

You are bang on about going slow on this, take your own sweet time. Listen to as many setups as possible.

Dear Raftuq,

The Marantz amp is 3 months old. I picked it up w/o papers from a friend of mine. If I am right, he was using it for nearly 2 years.

Ya, do ur home work and then proceed. I was lucky enough to have good audiophile friends, who helped me/guided me to narrow down my choice, when I was like u. I prefer indian classical music (hindustani) and jazz. I was impressed with the performance of this marantz amp. Any how, if u would like to have an audition, u r welcome. I have given my contact number. U may like to furnish your no., I will get in touch with you.

My pre and power combo is doing well. I am yet to relocate them on a rack. Once it is done, Audiophiles are cordially invited for an audition session and critical evaluation and advice to tweak them.

Namaste to all the audio buffs.


Regards

soulforged schrieb:

MS again are pretty laid back speakers, so they would also suit ur music. I haven't heard the 904 but it supposed to be the floorstanding version of 902 which is a very good speaker. Are you really sure you want to go for floorstanders?

Laid back -I have read this in many posts but am not sure what this means(?) Kinda sounds lazy. Heck, I'd want my speakers to sweat it out while I'm laid back

Am I sure about floorstanders? You may laugh at this, but I have a fetish for floor standers

Raftuq,

A speaker is described as laid back when the bass (low freq) and treble (hi freq) is more accentuated than the mid range. To me this characteristic of the speaker makes it well suited for classical.

And trust me, most of us start off with a facination for floorstanders (I had and I got them) but at the end of the day, how they sound should ideally score over how they look. I would suggest not to strike off bookshelves completely. Do give them half an ear at least...and avoid comparing a bookshelf and a floorstander...they would almost certainly sound different...but after all said and done its upto your ears...(and your pockets)

I would rather say that the lower midrange and upper bass is these is slightly recessed than normal

Lots of terms here

http://www.stereophile.com/reference/50/index.html

soulforged schrieb:

Raftuq, A speaker is described as laid back when the bass (low freq) and treble (hi freq) is more accentuated than the mid range. To me this characteristic of the speaker makes it well suited for classical. And trust me, most of us start off with a facination for floorstanders (I had and I got them) but at the end of the day, how they sound should ideally score over how they look. I would suggest not to strike off bookshelves completely. Do give them half an ear at least...and avoid comparing a bookshelf and a floorstander...they would almost certainly sound different...but after all said and done its upto your ears...(and your pockets)

Thanks soulforged. Oh dear! and I thought it was the midrange that mattered most in indian classical (to be more precise listening to vocal and sitar)??

Arj, thx for the link. Also, is there a site which lists all instruments (well most, and the human voice) and their frequencies?

'Fetish' for floorstanders? Boy thats a good one Raf!

BTW I have a Marantz stereo amp and I really like the music that comes out of it.

Cheers,
Shri

raftuq schrieb:

Arj, thx for the link. Also, is there a site which lists all instruments (well most, and the human voice) and their frequencies?

hope these help..

http://www.tnt-audio.com/topics/frequency_e.html
http://www.studystack.com/studytable-27242

I had some mor lonks bookmarked but lost it in a notebook crash

Diamond 8.4 is one ideal choice for you dear Raftuq.
Looking at your Fetish for Floors, Choice of music, Size of room...Diamond is THE most ideal choice at this point of time IMO. Trying to experiment with other speakers is fine but that would be sheer experimentation and its difficult to get past Diamond again IMO. Bookshelves are good option, but looking at your strict budget and considering the fact that you have to shell out another 6-7k for the stands, that means you have 14-15k left for the speakers and thats a tight budget to get a bookshelf speaker which has better all round performance than the Diamond 8.4. Still you can go ahead and give them a chance...who knows..

Here is more dope on frequencies from the PSB site.I think it will clarify a lot for you.

http://www.psbspeake...8&page_num=1&start=0

Hey arj, you had posted this link many moons back if you remember.

Cheers

PS - Since you are at it do audition Accoustic Portraits,a local brand manufactured in good 'ol Bangaluru by Siva, who is also a member of this forum.

Arj, Krish, Thx for the links.

Abhi, yes the diamonds sounded favorable, though Decibels used a Yamaha AVR to demo it the Rotel would arrive only after 2 weeks; till such time am checking out the Marantz (that so many of you recommended) and a few others...

What about power conditioning? Should I be using a UPS or CVT? Also what cables? I have some noname RCA cables; would I need to change these or are quality cables only noticeable with high-end amps and sources?

raftuq schrieb:

... what cables? I have some noname RCA cables; would I need to change these or are quality cables only noticeable with high-end amps and sources?

There's no one answer to that man. It is the most tiringly debated topic amongst the audiophile community.

Thanks Shahrukhbhai, you have saved me a few bucks already! What about the power? What do you use -UPS, stabilizer, CVT, nothing?

... what cables? I have some noname RCA cables; would I need to change these or are quality cables only noticeable with high-end amps and sources?

No point spending money for what your ears dont hear... thats the purpose of listning to equipment, before buying.

So trust your ears.

If you hear a difference, buy. If not, skip.

They say our ears are usually as lousy ( ) as the system we buy. Slowly, are listning gets more critical. You can always buy better cable later, if you hear the difference then.....

I would second amp nut, get the meat first, the gravy can always be added on top.

Yeah...but what good is meat without the juice and the gravy ?

yeah, but there is a little bit of juice and the gravy to begin with


My take is that the money is better spent on getting good electronics. Get used to the sound first and then add the rest as and when you can. This way you'd be better placed to discern the differnce in the sound.

I'm going down the same path. Still using a decent OFC speaker cable. Would pick up the better ones later.

I went ahead and bought the wharfedale 8.4's!!!

Anand (Decibels) was kind enough to loan me a Yamaha AVR till such time that my Rotel arrives. I earlier had decided on RA01 (without remote) since I thought I could use the Source's remote. How stupid of me! Soon realized that the mute doesn't work on the line out of the sources. This was an important discovery for me since I therefore realized that the RA02 (with remote) would be more practical and ordered the same!!

Not sure what the price rationale is, though: the remote adds to 5.5 K to the price!!! I am almost tempted to try out the other amps that are out there - especially since the delivery date of the RA02 is still not confirmed.

One question - how does one decide how much to crank up the volume of the source to get the best sound? Not sure this would matter at line level but I'm referring to stuff like ipods. If I connect the headphone out to the amp, how do you determine the optimum volume setting on the ipod? Would you recommend that the volume on ipod be kept as low as possible and use the volume of the amp to increase or decrease the loudness? - Or is it better to keep the ipod high and amp low on volume?

Thx

If I connect the headphone out to the amp, how do you determine the optimum volume setting on the ipod? Would you recommend that the volume on ipod be kept as low as possible and use the volume of the amp to increase or decrease the loudness? - Or is it better to keep the ipod high and amp low on volume?

Not too critical in this application, as long as neither the ipod or Amp Volume is set too low.

Ideal setting would be Amp about 9 o clock to 12 o clock, and the Ipod to Full output.

i would suggest getting dock for the iPOd hence getting a proper line out.
it takes the load out of the understandably wimpy amp in the ipod.

One thing you will find is that the output of the iPOD is quite low.. I had decent results with my pre-amp volume at around the 50% mark and then adjusting the iPOd volume to around the same.. but that will again depend on the gain in your amp

Yes, I'll go ahead and get a universal dock for the line out....Thanks guys!

Hi, I am, and have been an iPod fan for about 1 year. I own a 60 GB Video ipod, with content in 320 KBps mp3 and Apple Lossless format software on it.

Have got myself a dock for the V-pod.

My observation is that there is No radical sound quality difference between the audio from the Vpod Headphone out or the Dock out. The Headphone output is about 50% ( or less ? ) louder than the Dock output.

The major reported deterioration in the pod sound is reportedly from its Volume control, which remains Very much in place for both the dock and Headphone output.

The dock adds a Remote control for Volume, and next / previous track, as well as a Video ( S-Video) output for the Vpod dock.

However these features aside, there is no compelling reason to opt for the universal dock, on the basis of sound quality.

I agree with you on the sound quality part no difference... i have a 3G 40GB one and in those times the dock was in cluded in the package.. hence always felt it gives a very convenient option.

for playbeack these days I use only my Airport express...

Now pleeeeese solve my curosity here....

I have a Creative Zen Touch 20GB player and a MS-1 headphone.
The other day I did an experiment.

1. First I connected my mp3 player to my stereo setup and tried playing a mp3 track (encoded at 320 kbps), the player doesnt have a linenout so I connected to the headphone out and set the volume level of the player to max. Then immediately I played the same track through my CDP (NAD-521) using the Audio CD.
I found that the sound quality was much much better with the CD playback. The frequency extension, texture as well as the LOUDNESS LEVEL all of them improved a lot.
Infact I had to turn down the volume few notches to reach the same loudness that I got off the mp3 player.
So I inferred that CDP output levels are much higher than mp3 players (off the headphone out).

2. Next, I listened to the same track from the mp3 player but this time on my MS-1 headphones, again with the volume at max.
Then shifted onto the CDP, it doesnt have a headphone out so I used the same lineout that was connected to my amp previously and tried listening to the same track from the Audio CD through the headphone.
I was expecting a huge gain in LOUDNESS LEVEL from the CDP when compared to the mp3 player because thats what I discovered in my first test. But to my surprise, the loudness was much much lesser than the mp3 player.
Though the quality had definitely improved off the CDP but the quantity had diminished a lot.

Now howz that....
How is it that through my stereo setup the CDP is sounding louder but through my headphones the mp3 player is sounding louder ????????????

Hi Abhi,

1. Please do Not confuse Volume for quality. Infact, louder music, on initial listning is often confused to be better quality. Hence make comparisions Only at Absolutely Equal volumes... difficult in practice.

Ofcourse you have done that, as mentioned in your post.

2. About the differences in volumes.... the MP-3 player output is a low impedence output, designed to feed headphones directly. These headphones typically have an impedance ( ie present a load ) of 8 ohms to 32 ohms... the latter being more typical.

The CD Player on the other hand, si designed to feed a Pre amp or a Power amp, which usually has an impedance of around 5,000 (5K) to 10,000 (10K) ohms. Hence, when you connected the CD player directly to 32 ohm headphones, the Volume simply colapsed.

( This is a no tech explanation, and I have tried to keep it simple )

Cheers

Hi Amp_nut,
Though I am getting some of your points but not entirely.
I understood that whereas mp3 players are designed to suit headphones which are around 32ohms but CDPs are designed to feed a Pre-amp which are around 5000-10000 ohms so that might have affected the volume.

Basically do you mean that my headphone is a tougher load to the CDP than the amp it usually feeds ????

I understand this impedance thing wrt speakers...basically higher the impedance easiler is the load on the amp etc etc...
but whats the difference between high-impedance output and low impedance output ?

whats the difference between high-impedance output and low impedance output ?

High Impedance Implies Low Current

Low Impedence implies High Current.

Hence yr CD Player is designed to put out Low Current ( but a higher voltage swing ... Upto 2.8 Volts ) into the amplifier. It cant cope with the demands of high current, from the 32 Ohm Head phone. So it cant put out anywhere near that 2.83 Volts into a 32 Ohm headphone.

Your MP-3 player can put out High Current ( relatively,) but has a low output voltage.

The amplifier input hardly draws any current, but it cannot reveive more voltage than what is the Max output voltage of the mp-3 player.

Hope this helps

hmmmmmmmm.........coooooooooooool

ummm.....how did the discussion about wharfedale and rotel turn to mp3 players??